To: K-list
Recieved: 2003/09/24 01:26
Subject: [K-list] Good fear/bad fear -- the understanding.
From: elargonauto
On 2003/09/24 01:26, elargonauto posted thus to the K-list:
*I've really appreciated this thread, and all the
*thought that's gone into it... Helpful for some of my
*own thinking on fear...
I´m glad that you have found something of value.
*As usual, i seem to have more questions than answers.
Don´t worry. :).
*Rich's example of being caught in the riptide with 6
*foot swells elicited a sense of fear in me, too... And
*when i thought of that *fear* with his next example -
*the fear of heights and falling - i reacted strongly
*too (being really afraid of heights since falling
*while tree climbing)... But what i noticed is a
*difference in the two fears, and i wonder if anyone
*else would see it to... The feeling of being caught in
*the riptide felt like ok, you're in the middle of this
*terrifying wild ride and there is fear to the center
*of your being. It is real time and immediate.
*What i sensed when reading about the heights fear
*though felt more like anxiety or worry... Worried
*about falling... For me, if i were in the middle of a
*fall, i think it would then be a real fear - terror
*that i'm falling...
I think the difference is in intensity. The first is a situation
where the risk is very, very high, at the second there exist only a
posibility ( staying at a balcony, for example). And if you lower the
intensity enough, I think, you can connect with feelings like "feeling
unconfortable" or with anxiety.
But I don´t agree that the natural response if you are in the middle
of a terrifying wild ride would be of panicking. I think it could be too an
adrenalin outburst that would precesely help you centering in the moment,
like a dose of caffeine.
I have felt both situtaions. At some dangerous situation I have felt
that outburst of adrenalin that has taken me to make things I wouldn´t do
usually and with very good results. And I have been taken by fear too at
other situations losing all my self-control and having a poor vision of me
afterwards.
At one experience I had a tense situation with a friend. At that
moment I felt absolutely still and centered in the moment. But curiously my
friend only remenbered that I was breathing heavy, that is a sign that you
are under tension. He thought I was "nervous", "not-centered", but in fact I
was as centered as I could have been. I think people reacts of tension as
something bad, when in facts it have the two side of the coin. In this
experience I was tense, but because, I guees, I was using an extra amount of
energy to feel, hear, or react at whatever situation.
I´m remenbering now a day I was to do something at a structure who
was about eight meters from the floor. I went up with a partner. He felt
very unconfortable and wanted to go down. But when he started he got
freezed. Whe had to be speaking with him for some minutes until he felt
secure enough to go down. So, fear of heights can be very high, reaching a
freeze like in this situation.
*Maybe i'm splitting hairs here, but the fear of
*falling seems anticipatory - tied to something that
*might happen in the future - and therefore could it be
*more a state of anxiety, of worry?
I normally associate "anxiety" to hurry, to have to do a lot of
things, to lose patience. You can feel fear of a situaion in advance without
any problem. If you are obligated to go inside of a wild bear cave tomorrow
you won´t sleep very well. And it could be you don´t feel too much fear the
first time, but if you now about the experience, you´ll going to pass a lot
of fear in advance. Your body advising you that the situation is going to be
very dificult.
*If that's the case, would it be helpful to get
*grounded back in the now and remember that one's feet
*are still on the ground? Like maybe some self-talk and
*a visualization to remind oneself that the imagined
*future is an illusion and i am here, now, and whole
*(more or less)?
I think this asumption, comes from thinking that this fears have no
reason to exist. I think they have. You have had a bad experience, and your
body advice you whenever is going to repeat, and as much advance the best.
He is trying to help you.
Why did you had that bad experience? That would be a good question.
*But the skills needed to cope with the realtime fear -
*in the whirling waters would be different?
I think it is the same. If you have a good relation with fear, at
dificult situations it is going to be there to help you, not to disturb you.
*Someone asked about whether the person in cardiac
*arrest, no pulse, with a minute left to live felt
*fear? People who have reported near-death-experiences
*don't seem to report fear, but calm. Me, i'm not
*afraid of death, but i am afraid of being horribly
*hurt and left in agony alive.
Well, I don´t know too much about this experiences. But if the
natural response of the human to dificult situation were to be shocked I
can´t imagine how we have survived. :).
*Anyway, i am sorry this was so long. But i really do
*appreciate what you have all been sharing. For me, it
*seems like sometime there is no way to logic my way
*through old trauma, but a silly little ritual seems to
*help.
I think that the idea of all this is to be patient enough to let
pass this disruptive feelings so they can be reintegrated. And if a ritual
helps doing this, why not?.
Thanks to you. This subject could be my master degree in life
right now. And it makes me feel very good that you find valuable information
in it.
Chao!
elargonauto
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