To: K-list
Recieved: 2003/02/14 22:00
Subject: [K-list] k-list] Psychopomps (for ken again)
From: Dean Robbins
On 2003/02/14 22:00, Dean Robbins posted thus to the K-list:
Hi beautiful Ken,
Thanks for replying to my email, may we continue:
(snip)
> >It is an interesting point you have raised....is the pure feeling, an
expression of samadhi. Because I have also had this experience you have
described. Is it just being, without doing? I know that words are inadequate
to express this state, but can you explain this to me to help me?
> You should take what I am about to say with a IMHO in front of it :)
Namsaste Ken...
After all, it is a rational interpretation of a subjective experience.
So I can't offer any objective, scientific, experimental data to support
these ideas.
That's okay, I understand.
> A few times, during deep meditation, I've experienced what coincides
with the description of samadhi by various yogis -- a loud roaring sound, a
rush of blissful energy up my spine, and a sense of awareness that went
beyond my physical body. The experiences were overwhelming, and I couldn't
maintain them for very long. However, I was left with a feeling that what I
really am is part of a universal field of pure awareness.
I have had similar experiences and can identify with what you're saying. --
During a few meditations, I once lossed my sense of individuality (or sense
of ego). It desolved and fell away
for a few moments. It was a very profound experience. During that brief
moment I was aware of what I would call the non-
existence of "myself" ( if that makes sense). In its place, I experienced a
total and utter freedom or abandonment. There was no thinking or conception
of time and space.-- The whole experience did not register with my memory
until I became aware of my physical presence. Metaphorically, I felt as
though an enormous weight had been lifted off of my shoulders. After the
experience, I became acutely aware of my so-called "little" self and ego as
a heavy burden; I realised it was a form of suffering in itself. This
concerned me, as I felt
that everybody was carrying around the same burden as myself... I felt so
sad.
> After a while, I started getting turned-off by all the bhakti
(devotional) aspects of the yoga system I was in, and its emphasis on
attaining the blissful samadhi state. So, I found myself becoming
re-interested in
Zen Buddhism, which placed more of an emphasis on knowledge rather than
feeling. It's not that I didn't like, even crave those states of
bliss, but I was more inclined understand what it all meant. I guess I
started
wondering what use samadhi was -- how did it help me understand and help
save
others from suffering.
Do you think craving is intrinsic to bliss? I desire the same thing from my
meditation. However, paradoxically, when I had
the sense of ego or "self" drop away in meditation; there was no craving
whatsoever.
> What I believe now is that our simple awareness is what differentiatesus
from inanimate objects -- that this awareness is our true nature --our
essence. There are many people who believe that computers will eventually
become so sophisticated that they will achieve consciousness. Yet I believe
that no matter how complex they become, they will still just be blind
processing machines.
I Agree. How can inanimate objects ever be sentience?
>They will not be truly aware of themselves or what they are doing. These
same people believe that consciousness is an emergent phenomeno produced by
the brain alone.
Imo, The brain cannot exist without consciousness. The brain would be inert
matter. Without consciousness, it would be literally be, "brain" dead.
>Yet I feel (based largely on these samadhi events) that our self is
transcendental. I don't think our ego lives after death, as it seems like
an inner shell attached to the body, but I think our true self, our
awareness continues -- possibly forever.
Yes, I agree that our Self is truly transcendent. My understanding of the
ego is that it is purely a defense mechanism. Its sole purpose is to survive
in this life; in and of itself, it is purely instrumental in protecting the
physical animal. However, this instinct (ime) still continues to survive
even after physical death until such time we realise that nothing can harm
us anymore. This is when we come to know our true nature as immortal? I
think then, that the ego dissolves naturally? -- Have you ever noticed how
much small children are (with such beautiful innocence) totally unaware of
danger. They don't even understand the concept of pain and suffering until
they come into contact with it. Could it be that their awareness is grounded
in their pure (unsuffering) Nature? Could it be that they are "that" which
only knows perfection before suffering. Perhaps their "ego" is only born
when they have a taste of suffering, and that for the rest of their lives
they manifest ego to prevent further suffering. -- Interstesting question,
yeah?
Thanks for your time and energy Ken, you are much appreciated.
with much love,
Dean
>
> _
>
>
>
DISCLAIMER!
Home | Archive Index | Search the archives | Subscribe
K. List FAQ | Kundalini FAQs | Signs and Symptoms | Awakening Experiences | K. list Polls | Member Essays | Meditations | List Topics | Art Gallery | Cybrary | Sitemap | Email the moderators.
symbol.