To: K-list
Recieved: 2002/09/23 09:34
Subject: Re: [K-list] Re: on Free will and Destiny
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent
On 2002/09/23 09:34, Mystress Angelique Serpent posted thus to the K-list:
At 09:39 PM 21/09/02, mundaneyogi wrote:
>
--- In Kundalini-GatewayATnospamy..., "Louis" wrote:
> > The idea is that every action to the smallest thing that you do is
> > done for your own self interest conciously or not, and that free
> > will is a myth.
>
>This statement sounds self-contradictory. Without free will, how
>could "you do" anything for "your own self-interest"?
Instinctively.
Age 2, a child learns to say no. Learns to not go with the flow. To
resist... to assert it's will. Grows an ego... learns to act differently
than it feels. Learns that it is polite to share, and to respect
property... get civilized. Learns to pretend to be selfless, not selfish.
The selfish part goes underground.
How can you truly act in your own self interest, if you do not really
know what or who you are?
> You could posit that "Your every action is pre-ordained, but you have the
>illusion of it happening out of self-interest and with free will",
>or "Your every action is pre-ordained, and happens for your BEST
>interest; free will is an illusion".
Free will is illusion, and it is an important part of the illusion. No
hugs without an illusion-of-other.
> > The things that you do in your self interest are due to a
> > chain of events that led to that action. The first chain of
> > events may have started with the big bang or something like that.
> > It could all be calculated, allthough it is massively complex. If
> > you were to attach a special machine that that measured nerve
> > impulses and muscle movement when you tossed a die, the roll
> > wouyld be predicted.
>One crazy sounding idea, that actually fits the latest scientific
>observations and theories (quantum mechanics, relativity, etc.)
>quite well, is that ALL possibilities actually occur, but in
>parallel universes.
Yes... move out of time and space, and ideas of evolution collapse...
Everything is happening, all at once and we shift dimensions with our
thoughts. Every roll of the die occurs, somewhere, some when. Everything
that can be, is... and which one we experience, is part of a game called
free will.
> > My guess is that if there is no such thing as randomness, that
> > free will is a perceived myth.
I remember a trip K. took me on, in spring of 1996. I had been
channelling various beings, and a grey alien was showing up in my mirror,
so clear and steady I could contemplate the fine lines in the dove grey
skin around those deep pools of eyes. Turn my head, see the side of its head.
Sometime after this, noticing the various voices of my thoughts and not
knowing which were my own, who I was being in any given moment... I went
into a nosedive. Flipped out freaking. The harder I tried to sort out which
thoughts are my own, the more hopeless it seemed. Trying to sort out whose
thoughts had made what decisions, for each moment of my life history, so I
could locate and identify the "I" that was the real me, sent me into crying
fits. My ego had shattered into a billion pieces, each one a separate
persona. who I had been, for each thought in my life... and the only
comfort, was in being all of them, all at once and not try to sort them
out. Doing that, was so blissful that I finally abandoned the impossible
task and gave up trying to know. There was no "I" there was only We, all of
them.
I tried to express it for a while... to speak in a way that was in
alignment with my radically changed sense of self... I sounded like queen
victoria. Avoided referring to myself in any conversation, at all for for a
while before I got adjusted to the shift and decided to go back to
conventional speech and not try to explain the impossible...
For quite a while after this, I had an occasional sig file that said
that the life script had been written by the infinite number of monkeys who
wrote Shakespeare...
I also got the insight, that I.. whoever that was... had really not
made any of the choices. It appeared to be free will, but my options were
always slanted in a certain direction. Baited somehow. Synchronicity
providing the carrot and stick for donkey me. Other options were made just
unavailable or uncomfortable enough to avoid. Puppet on strings... thinking
there was an "I" who had been in control.
>This reminds me of a book by Voltaire called "Candide". It
>reflects a popular theory of the day which is similar to your
>idea. Since God is perfect, his world must be perfect. It is
>expressed by a character in the book named Dr. Pangloss -- "All's
>for the best in this, the best of all possible worlds". Voltaire
>goes on to show all the misery and suffering in the world, as proof
>that all is not perfect.
I had a similar conversation with my sister last summer. She is ten
years older than me, and a K-baby, at the phase of righteousness and war on
evil. She could not prove the existence of evil to me, any more than I
could prove perfection. I did not try very hard... seeing perfection in her
being at that phase of growing.
> > I'd like to hear what you have to say about that, thats whats been
> > on my mind lately. Maybe you can point out a model of true
> > randomness,
>Brownian motion comes to mind.
Tea leaf readers would say it is not randomnesss... :)
Blessings...
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