To: K-list
Recieved: 2001/06/14 05:24
Subject: Re: [K-list] silly ponderings: capitalism, end of nature, animal spirits
From: Nina
On 2001/06/14 05:24, Nina posted thus to the K-list:
--- In Kundalini-GatewayATnospamy..., BestPoetATnospama... wrote:
> <<The waves are huge. Consider what Susan had to say about the
impossibility of isolating the subject from its context. The urge to
symbiote (new verb) is too great.
>
> Our context is culture, and since we subjects perpetuate and invent
culture, how could we be isolated from it?
Yes.
> <<Nature, as we have called it, is dead. Has been... for some time.
>
> Now this is something I've thought about a lot. While it's true,
Nature as I think of it, or know it, is cha-cha-ing into the sunset
rapidly, whatever is replacing that is still nature, isn't it?
We "humans" are of nature, and all of our resources come from nature,
so even tho we process and genetically change stuff, it's still
nature. Nothing can be unnatural or even supernatural, when I really
think about it. Perhaps I can "evolve" genetic food and an oxygen-
stripped planet to the point where my particular species can't
survive, but whatever species are evolving right now will probably be
suited to the new environment. The earth will always cleanse herself
and renew, even if it takes her a million years. She has time. I
guess we do too, since energy never dies.
Yup. This inextricability (another new word? hehe) from nature is
clear. I believe this phrase 'End of Nature' has more to do with the
balance of where the change is coming from... something of a
political slant, a sentimentality, perhaps a call for more awareness
of what effect human tamperings have on the "culture"
or "environment" we live in. The awareness this list has about the
depth and breadth of breathing the continuum is not the generally
expressed awareness.
> And I wonder, just what species ARE evolving right now? I really
believe that just cause we all look human, doesn't mean we are. I'm
quite sure I'm not the same species as, President Bush, say.
:) Yes, for President Bush, these are "dangerous times".
Well, yes, about the continual evolution... and the ability for
evolution to roll right through crisis points, as the 'End of Nature'
projects. Everything is in a state of flux, registering and informing
the change. When one piece no longer serves or responds, it drops
away.
However, try talking to people about how humans are not the end-all
of this evolutionary process... that the buck doesn't stop here.
(Hrm... thinking about that one in terms of responsibility... that we
also don't have the responsibility to alter the process? Or is it
natural for us to alter the process to perpetuate ourselves?) Try
telling someone that their world could end tomorrow and the earth
wouldn't miss a beat, just keep on spinning, flinging our filth off
like dirty clothes. :) Is it self-consciousness that keeps 'us'
interested in our future? What is it?
I wonder if other currently existing species care so much that humans
are helping to make this planet uninhabitable for them? Are we
projecting this will to live on them... based on our own wills to
live? What awareness do they have of their own being and becoming,
individually, collectively?
Is this all so internally ingrained that it makes no sense to try to
root it out? The closer one gets to the root, the deeper it grows?
I recall reading about the reflex towards stability in populations of
deer. Start with a certain size of deer population and introduce the
limiting factor of a shortage of space (which often means food). The
deer will become psychotic, eventually killing enough of themselves
off to return to stasis with the given amount of space... it seems
that deer require a certain amount of space per deer (makes sense, as
space often means food). This psychotic killing spree is essentially
a cleansing... ridding the population of deer that couldn't survive
the stress or the attack... or attack back. Start with the same
equation, but introduce boundaries... in the form of cages or fences
that separate the deer. This effectively creates more space between
the deer. The psychosis will be reduced considerably, perhaps even
disappear.
So, that's a root... but where does it lead?
This is fascinating to think about in terms of human populations and
settlements... a window on why rural enclaves work the way they work
and why cities work the way they work. Mix in the elements of
interspecies dynamic of give and take vs. take and take and the
picture grows in a beautifully complex way.
Sideline: there is a will to live, but also a deathurge... what is
that about? Is it my own foible, or is it universally evident?
> Our species is certainly multi-vultural and always has been, I
guess, but I keep hoping it's because we're a young species, and
still have neolithic tears in our eyes from fearing the dark and cold
and hunger. Perhaps we will be able to grow beyond this.
>
> Perhaps not.
:) Seems that it may be time for Borg implants.
incoherently,
Nina
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