To: K-list
Recieved: 2001/04/05 07:42
Subject: [K-list] relationship and communication
From: Jb789
On 2001/04/05 07:42, Jb789 posted thus to the K-list:
Hi
Since this subject could easily be considered dualistic, I wonder
whether I am not already disqualified and so perhaps best not to
write at all.
But even so, another ½ hour of waste, will probably not impede my
eventual illumination..(?!)
Since the following is something I've been presented with thru many
years, it weighs heavy (if you ask 'on Whom ?' then I am chess mate
and I might as well watch Tv and suffer on..unless you say 'Who's
suffering ?'.. :o) )..
..so I might be able to write thousands of words,.. but I will try
hard not to take too much of your time.
It is about communication in an intimate relationship.
About her incomplete messages (I have to guess the first/half part),
.. her apparent living in her private world of -romantic mentality
which wanting undisturbed, looks away from the actuality of our
relating. About my being drained of energy, when having to often
repeat a statement or practical info, at least 3 times before being
heard.. and sometimes not even then,..
I am not talking about a lack of some subtle form of non-
verbal 'spiritual' communication, but about an utterly messy/chaotic
_Verbal_ communication about even the simplest of matters.
She is not 'stupid'; she is very loving (at least in the 'normal'
usage of that word), has good intentions to change it.. but since
intentions are not enough to do it,.. it just keeps on.
For an occasional misunderstanding or not listening,..getting a talk
about 'sugar' as a reply to 'please, pass the salt'.. however off
that might be, one does not have to be a Buddha to menage without
great irritation. But how about 20 of such incidents a day ?
Personally, at some point, the body starts to shake inwardly and
despair sets in. Because after 5 years of making her aware of
this, .. talking.. talking.. well I am burned out by now.
A couple of 'communication' samples:
- Passing by a grocer's I say: Look at those nice melons.. should'nt
we buy one ?.. her reply: 'oh yes, lemon, we need lemon.. let's buy
lemon !' . I say ' but, what about the melon ?..' .. she:'for the
fish, lemon for the fish..' I say: 'ok, but I asked about the
melon .. why do you keep on talking about lemon ?'.. she:'because, I
ahve some very nice fish home and it needs lemon..'
- In an add about an apt. (are planning to ove in together.. still
not sure about this one !?)it was stated that :'_minimum 2 persons
were required, to be able to move in'.
I've told her this about 5-7 times and also shown it to her, in black
and white.
At some point she says. 'well, i can always sign up my daughter also
if they want 3, because that's what I've done when i moved in this
apt. and..' I reply. 'what are you talking about.. why do you talk
about 3 persons ..?' she: ' well, because that's what i've done.. and
somebody told me that to move in a row house 3 people are necessary
and ..' I : ' you are talking about a hypotetical apt.,.. is all that
talk necessary,.. should we not relate to -This one ?.. it says here
that min. 2 are sufficient, that means 2 is ok, .. _me and you_ equal
2, no .. equal ok, no ??'.. she 'aaaa, ah yea, minimum, yea 2'..
- when we agree on something, _often_ she does not seem to register
regardless of how simple and concrete the message is... when her
actions do not correspond to the agreement, her ussual response is
one of justifying by starting a sentence with 'I forgot...' or 'I
thought you said..'
- She just removed my pipe tobacco from my pouch. I say'please give
me back the tobacco so I do not forget to take it with me' and I
point to it (was close to her).. she: 'Ohhh,.. the tobacco jar is
empty, and is in the kitchen,.. ohh..no more tobacco I smoked it
all..'.. I: what tobacco are talking about ?'.. she: ' well, you gave
it to me 3 weeks ago,.. in the kitchen..'..
well I started to shake inwardly non-Buddha style : 'for gods sake, I
pointed to the one lying next to you..!'
Well I'd better stop before I provoke too much detached/nondualistic
thinking in the reader.
But imagine yourself exposed to this input hundreds of times...
Where would your non-reactional awareness beyond good/bad, be at ?
Should one carry on with it, in the name of 'seeing ones reactions'
and not escaping ?
With age, the sexual togetherness naturally withers (unless you're
willing to torture yourself with 'tantric' manipulation).. so if
there is not some sane verbal communication, what is -left ?
As for the non-verbal one,.. the Being/unconditional love, .. can
that fragile flower of communion be, if the verbal is utter chaos,
feeding a lot of high-blood pressure, nervous states etc. ?
Can that communion be, when one abides in complete Non-Presence..
except for her presence to her own personal univers' romantic
creations ?
To be honest, at times I feel that either I get a nervous breakdown or
become apathetic, speechless and with a voluntarily numbed
sensitivity to what's happening around me.. (no see/no hear),..
called perhaps manio-depression.
There is love for her, so there is this dilemma.
One attitude could be : "that's ok,.. small thing !, let the woman
chatter away,.. she cooks nice food for you and you get your sex, so
what's the big deal ?!"
Well, I cannot hop on that 'solution'.
Really, I feel I do not need anything from another.. I can have a
good life alone,.. it's just that a possibility for a 'dance'..
steping lightly does not have to be excluded.
But that dance cannot even start.. due to the above mentioned noise
one cannot hear the 'music' !
And now, looking for an apt....
I am probably more confused than she is..
She wished for years that we move in...
Apart from 'all is illusion.. your not the body, mind, emotions,
ears, words..you are -That' what else would you say to this poor chap
in despair ?
JB
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