To: K-list
Recieved: 2001/01/23 02:35
Subject: Re: [K-list] Digest Number 430
From: seow zhiming
On 2001/01/23 02:35, seow zhiming posted thus to the K-list:
Sorry, I feel that the message is too long and I do not have time to read it. Please advise any way to unscribe it. Thank you.
Kundalini-GatewayATnospamegroups.com wrote:
>
> -------
>
> There are 18 messages in this issue.
>
> Topics in this digest:
>
> 1. Re: Reply to David Bozzi
> From: David Bozzi <david.bozziATnospamnetzero.net>
> 2. Re: hmmmmmm ....
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> 3. the True Nature of God
> From: "b.holland" <b.hollandATnospamworldonline.cz>
> 4. Dan Winter
> From: "b.holland" <b.hollandATnospamworldonline.cz>
> 5. Re: "If I forget thee .. oh Earth".
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> 6. Re: hmmmmmm ....
> From: "b.holland" <b.hollandATnospamworldonline.cz>
> 7. Through the eyes of another
> From: Christopher Wynter <anundaATnospamone.net.au>
> 8. Re: hmmmmmm ....
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> 9. Re: Dan Winter
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> 10. Re: Reply to Sylvia->Carol
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> 11. Re: Through the eyes of another
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> 12. Re: Reply to Sylvia->Carol
> From: sylbarATnospamlabyrinth.net.au
> 13. Re: In those days part 1
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> 14. Re: Through the eyes of another
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> 15. Pearls
> From: "Michael Read" <mareadATnospamix.netcom.com>
> 16. Re: Through the eyes of another
> From: "percyval" <percyvalATnospamrcn.com>
> 17. George W. Judas (was: reply about Percyval's answer to Carol's reply to percyval (was: reply to Carol replying to David the Human Mirror ; ) )
> From: Ma An-Guo º¨¦wºê <gugusATnospampavo.seed.net.tw>
> 18. Re: Reply to David Bozzi
> From: nancy <nancyATnospamwtp.net
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 17:55:22 -0600
> From: David Bozzi <david.bozziATnospamnetzero.net>
> Subject: Re: Reply to David Bozzi
>
> "Carol C." wrote:
>
> > Let us gain some perspective. God is love, compassion, caring,
> > and to feel less than those emotions for others is to be out of touch with the reality of God.
>
> I can't speak for the Reality of God.
> Never met anyone who could.
>
> However, there are many who can speak with regard
> to what the Reality of God is not!
>
> God is not emotion.
> To believe otherwise is quite childish and foolish.
>
> > Nor can I stand by and watch another suffering without trying to do something to help. To shrug your
> > shoulders and say it is the will of God and not try to help another who is suffering is to be
> > unenlightened.
>
> If you are concerned with those who are unenlightened
> check to see if they are inhabiting a body of some sort (astral or physical)
> If they are, they are surely unenlightened.
>
> > Check out the examples of the enlightened ones; Jesus who healed the sick, Ghandi who gave to the
> > poor, and so many others. These are examples of how we are to regard others; with compassion and caring.
>
> Compassion and caring is of the formless stuff,
> which can take on many forms.
>
> > If to be enlightened is to be void of love, caring and compassion, then I doubt that those who profess
> > this have any experience with Light, because Light is Love beyond description, and compassion that is
> > overwhelming.
>
> 'Light', 'Love beyond description', 'Compassion that is overwhelming' are novel descriptions.
> What are you attempting to describe?
> (Please don't tell me)
>
> > This is the true nature of God and your true nature.
>
> No one can explain the True Nature of God.
> It's a devastating addiction to try,
> and extremely difficult to give up.
>
> > Do not believe and confuse all you read in books. Whether it is a person's karma that has designated
> > that person to suffer or not, is NOT OUR BUSINESS.
>
> A genuine understanding of Karma doesn't purport that another's suffering is not our business.
> On the contrary,
> a genuine understanding of Karma reveals
> that another's suffering is our own.
>
> > But to reach out with love and compassion to the Spirit in every person is our business,
> > because that Spirit in every person is GOD.
>
> Spirit is like sun.
> People are like clouds.
>
> To see the sun
> look through the clouds.
>
> David
> (cloudy)
>
>
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 17:49:58 -0500
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> Subject: Re: hmmmmmm ....
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Christopher Wynter <anundaATnospamone.net.au>
> To: <kundalini-gatewayATnospamegroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2001 4:57 PM
> Subject: Re: [K-list] hmmmmmm ....
>
> > At 08:26 AM 21/01/01, you wrote:
> > >Did I miss something here? Originally we were talking about all the
> > >JUDGEMENTS in regard to Jesus. As in .... Jesus was being JUDGED by
> certain
> > >phrases taken out of context from the Bible. As you yourself have said:
> > >"Seek not to judge, lest ye be judged.. Let the one who is without sin,
> cast
> > >the first stone." Does this not also apply to judging Jesus?
> >
> >
> > Yes Kathy,
> >
> > you did miss something here ..
> >
> > It is called the bottom line .. which was ..
> It's a funny thing ..
> but Jesus never said any of the things you (and others) say he said ..
> If you check out the "History of Language" you will find that the words
> attributed to him
> were not even thought of then ...
> So who is this collective thought-form Jesus
> you are putting words into the mouth of ..?
> ******************************************************************
>
> Here is your own quote back that you sent me:
> "Seek not to judge, lest ye be judged.. Let the one who is without sin, cast
> the first stone."
> These words are attributed to Jesus.
>
> So you may also be quoting a collective thought-form. As to the words used
> in scriptures; are they not translations made many centuries after the
> original words were written? I do not know. But this may explain the use of
> words that did not exist at the time of Christ. There is also a modern day
> translation of the Bible that contains words and language of the present
> day.
>
> When I first began reading scriptures at a young age they were only words
> that I tried to understand. But later, especially after studying the Gita,
> and Yogananda , and works written by other Yogis, the words of scripture
> became understandable. Somehow they ceased to be words, but rather
> Spiritual essence. And I came to love the beauty of the man Jesus who
> conveyed the same wisdom I had found in the Gita. I came to see the same
> Spiritual essence in all religions, inspite of the use of different words.
> >From that I came to realize there are Spiritual truths and it does not
> matter who conveys them. It is all Spirit. Spiritual essence is conveyed.
>
> The stories surrrounding the words of spiritual essence are not important to
> me. Even if Jesus did not exist I honour and love the essence conveyed and
> the spirit that conveyed it. Does it matter who conveyed it? All is Spirit.
> A name is nothing. I honour the spirit of the person that conveyed these
> truths.
>
> The teachings of Jesus are basically Judaism, but he added a few things such
> as Love, Forgiveness, and Compassion.. This was an important addition to the
> truths found in Judaism. What others did with his teachings is unimportant.
> The teachings still stand as a signpost along the way for seekers in this
> world, as do all spiritual essence contained in other religions. These
> teachings at least lead to the door, and after that it is up to the
> individual to find the way through the door to something higher.
>
> I am not bothered by some saying that Jesus did not exist. I honour the
> spiritual essence associated with his words, no matter where that essence
> originated in this world. It is the spiritual essemce I love and honour.
>
> Blessings and Love, Carol
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 23:51:44 +0100
> From: "b.holland" <b.hollandATnospamworldonline.cz>
> Subject: the True Nature of God
>
> > No one can explain the True Nature of God.
> > It's a devastating addiction to try,
> > and extremely difficult to give up.
>
> The True nature of God is the nature of reality.
> To quantify reality is like using a weighing scales to weigh itself. It can
> not be done from that perspective.
> However, it needs not to be quantified to recognized.
> To recognize the true nature of reality is to understand how a person's
> personality is modulated by chaos.
> This is what personalty is. The mother of chaos.
> When the personalty is understood to be chaos, then one can modulate it.
> When modulated, the persona becomes devoid of ego orientated perspective as
> in the weighing scales.
> Then liberation can be obtained, which is freedom for error or chaos.
> That is, knowing the mind in it's nakedness.
> Which can not be described in any way accurate, but can be known to oneself.
> The critical barrier is that off the "How can one know something if one is
> not oneself?"
> Which is the riddle to answer to the first question - The True nature of God
> is the nature of reality.
>
> Ben
>
>
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 23:53:02 +0100
> From: "b.holland" <b.hollandATnospamworldonline.cz>
> Subject: Dan Winter
>
> Does anyone here have an update on Dan Winter?
> Did something happen to him recently?
>
> I don't know, but I thought I saw a mail about 4 months ago saying there was a problem?
> I could be wrong.
>
> Ben
>
>
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 15:04:54 -0800
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> Subject: Re: "If I forget thee .. oh Earth".
>
> At 01:47 PM 1/20/01, Samantha Atkins wrote:
> >Enlightened beings don't sit around squabbling over pettiness. Go look
> >in a mirror.
> >
> >- samantha
>
> Well, they are, so they do.. :) Who told you they do not? Those
> squabbles are the stuff that Holy Wars are made of. Right now India is
> on the verge of war because the Muslims and Hindus both want to build a
> temple in the same patch of Earth.. because it is sacred to both of them,
> for different reasons. You'd think they could all just get along?
> Apparently not.
>
> I am always looking in a mirror. I know absolutely that anything I say
> is a reflection of myself. I talk about myself.. That is all I can see or
> know. Me me me!
>
> Most people do not get the joke, but I laugh at myself, a lot.. and
> speak anyway, because I am not much attached to how it appears. If you
> read all my posts with that in mind, you will get a good laugh, too.. at my
> expense.. but I don't mind.
> I was a comedienne before I became a Domina, and I excelled at playing
> low status fools, clowns, idiots, dogs ... with such empathy there was not
> a dry eye in the house. I switched to high status, for the challenge of it
> because it is so much harder.. low status was much too easy to be
> interesting. If I show up very humble, everyone falls in love with me and
> wants to do my bidding.. it is too easy. So I show up arrogant, conceited,
> judgmental and aggressive.. whoooooo hoooooo!! Fun fun fun.
>
> Picking a fight again, Samantha? LOL!!.. :) Hope your day gets
> better.... Isn't it funny how seeing the mighty slipping on a banana
> peel gives an emotional boost to the insecure? Does it make you feel
> better, to aim a barb in my direction? Happy to be of service.. Blast
> away! Careful tho, I might shoot back.. and you are a lot more vulnerable
> than I.
> Blessings..
> www.fire-serpent.com
> www.domin8rex.com
> www.Kundalini-gateway.org
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 00:00:24 +0100
> From: "b.holland" <b.hollandATnospamworldonline.cz>
> Subject: Re: hmmmmmm ....
>
> Actually The Bible is pretty much in tact, and since the Dead Sea Scrolls
> have been translated, it is amazing how much of it still holds the same to
> this day.
> Also Jesus did exists and this is a known proven historical fact. I think
> the only problem historians have is why Jesus is not mentioned in many Roman
> relics.
> This was always the back bone of Jesus did not exist argument, even though
> Paul brought the Gospel to the Romans, there is still no Roman evidence that
> Jesus existed...until now. I think that stuff has been found. I can get the
> website that have this data. Jesus existence is pretty much a solid
> historical fact.
>
> Ben
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 10:11:33 +1100
> From: Christopher Wynter <anundaATnospamone.net.au>
> Subject: Through the eyes of another
>
> This was just posted to my own discussion list ..
> I would present it here as perhaps
> a "quotable quote"
>
> >>> And I've gotta say, as a Jew,
> it never made me feel to good to go into a Catholic church
> and see the ultimate sign of sacredness
> is a Jew nailed, bloody and wounded, to a cross.<<<
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 15:18:59 -0800
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> Subject: Re: hmmmmmm ....
>
> Knock knock.. Hello, Carol. anybody home?? Christopher did not quote
> Jesus. I did.. Mystress Angelique Serpent, list Mistress.. Hello?
>
> Here's a clue: If you are not even understanding that much of what is
> being said to you, think of what else perhaps you are missing?
>
> At 02:49 PM 1/20/01, Carol C. wrote to Christopher:
> >Here is your own quote back that you sent me:
> >"Seek not to judge, lest ye be judged.. Let the one who is without sin, cast
> >the first stone."
> >These words are attributed to Jesus.
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 15:15:09 -0800
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> Subject: Re: Dan Winter
>
> At 02:53 PM 1/20/01, b.holland wrote:
> >Does anyone here have an update on Dan Winter?
>
> Yes. Here ya go! My most recent post from him.
>
> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 07:24:51 -0500
> From: dan winter <danATnospamdanwinter.com>
> Reply-To: danATnospamdanwinter.com
> Organization: danwinter.com sacred geometry
> Subject: internet radio with dan winter/sacred geo.Sat.7;30p,1/13
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854";
> x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> X-UIDL: M?!#!3f%"!BmO!!$Ug!!
>
> Subject:
> SPECIAL GUEST SAT JAN 13,2001 Events! Dan Winter Sacred
> Geometry
> Date:
> Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:40:22 -0700
> From:
> "Rob Meyers" <robmeyerATnospamsedona.net
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 18:30:29 -0500
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> Subject: Re: Reply to Sylvia->Carol
>
> Sylvia wrote:
> > I don't mean to offend you [or anyone here] but even when I was a very
> > little girl I found the 'Garden of Eden' story distasteful...... I have
> > just re-read it re your post [and having read Fiona's 'If I forget
> thee'].
> > A wave of anger swept over me the abuse of it.
> >
> > it is corrupt. I denounce it now as I have denounced it before.
> >
> > If it offends so be it. It is more of an offence to let it stand.
> ********************************************************************
>
> Dear Sylvia,
>
> You do not offend! I have never liked the story either, but have always
> felt that it may explain a turning point for humanity, a choice of seeking
> Light which does lead to a different view of things as evidenced by k
> experiences, or not seeking Light. The story was used to degrade women and
> as power over women. It has been a long struggle for women to emerge from
> the abuse of that paricular story. I too denounce the abuse, but feel
> intrigued by the other parts of the story, the choices implied. Sometimes it
> is difficult to separate truth fom the tradition it becomes shrouded in.
> Many are seeking k experiences today and it is leading many to a higher
> consciousness. Maybe the story is about the choice every human has in a
> lifetime, to seek Light or not to seek Light. I do not really know. Mere
> speculation.
>
> Many Blessings and Love, Carol
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 19:42:52 -0500
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> Subject: Re: Through the eyes of another
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Christopher Wynter <anundaATnospamone.net.au>
> To: <kundalini-gatewayATnospamegroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2001 6:11 PM
> Subject: [K-list] Through the eyes of another
>
> >
> > This was just posted to my own discussion list ..
> > I would present it here as perhaps
> > a "quotable quote"
> >
> > >>> And I've gotta say, as a Jew,
> > it never made me feel to good to go into a Catholic church
> > and see the ultimate sign of sacredness
> > is a Jew nailed, bloody and wounded, to a cross.<<<
> ****************************************************************
>
> My last reply! I'm done. Great cheer from the list. Fare thee well.
>
> My husband is a Jew, so I understand where this quote is coming from. He is
> comfortable with me because I am not Catholic or affiliated with any
> religion. I like to browse and enjoy whatever truth or beauty I can find in
> all religions. But I do know some things about the new Catholic religion,
> because I teach in a Catholic school. It has changed. All religions are
> taught in high school now, and all religions are honoured and respected by
> the church. Young people must study all religions in order to get a
> religious education credit. In other words the church has matured in its
> ideas. Yoga/Gita teachings are very popular with young catholics.
>
> Judaism and Christainity are basically the same religion. Christainity is
> mostly Judaism, with the few added teachings that Jesus gave. And then the
> church took over from there adding things until the two appeared very
> different. But the core beliefs are the same. The prayers in school are from
> every religion, including Judaism, Hinduism, and you name it. There is an
> obvious repect for the same Spirit contained in all religions. Is this nice
> to hear? It pleases me. Signs of change for the better.
>
> I do not think that the new symbols show Jesus hanging on the cross, except
> in some older buildings. I never liked the cross symbol either, and came to
> feel more repelled by it with time. Who wants to remember that? I would
> rather remember what he taught, and in fact what all of Judaism also
> teaches.
>
> The rift between Catholics and Jews has been misunderstanding, with a touch
> of politics and power thrown in. Allow the rift to die, because that is what
> is happening from the catholic point of view. It may be that the church is
> becoming all things to all people by embracing all religions. That way
> everyone is welcome. Perhaps I project my own thoughts on the world from
> preconception, but I love Jews, and in fact everyone, and like to think the
> collective consciousness is similar to my way of seeing. But I think it is
> true that people are less bigoted in their religions these days and more
> accepting of others.
>
> Many, Many Blessings and Love! Carol
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:38:12 +1000
> From: sylbarATnospamlabyrinth.net.au
> Subject: Re: Reply to Sylvia->Carol
>
> > Dear Sylvia,
> >
> > You do not offend! I have never liked the story either, but have always
> > felt that it may explain a turning point for humanity, a choice of seeking
> > Light which does lead to a different view of things as evidenced by k
> > experiences, or not seeking Light. The story was used to degrade women and
> > as power over women. It has been a long struggle for women to emerge from
> > the abuse of that paricular story. I too denounce the abuse,
>
> this is just the periphery of what I denounced...
> interesting that this is what you understand from what I sent.
> [+relevant to my ponderings re reflections/ manifestation]
> I leave it to others more adept than I...
> :)
> Sylvia
>
> > but feel
> > intrigued by the other parts of the story, the choices implied. Sometimes it
> > is difficult to separate truth fom the tradition it becomes shrouded in.
> > Many are seeking k experiences today and it is leading many to a higher
> > consciousness. Maybe the story is about the choice every human has in a
> > lifetime, to seek Light or not to seek Light. I do not really know. Mere
> > speculation.
> >
> > Many Blessings and Love, Carol
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.kundalini-gateway.org
> >
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 19:58:28 -0500
> From: "Carol C." <britcarATnospamtbaytel.net>
> Subject: Re: In those days part 1
>
> > Dear Carol, the story I have begun is not judgemental. The person Jesus
> was both
> > a human being and the divine in the flesh. His message to us is that we
> are what
> > he is/was.
> >
> > I have read and re-read the BG and many other scriptures. Have you read
> the
> > Ashtavakra Gita or the Song of the Avadhut?
> >
> > Chapter One Verse 51 of the Avadhut
> >
> > If water and water are mixed together,
> > There is no difference between one and the other.
> > It is the same with matter and spirit;
> > This is very clear to me.
> >
> > Be at peace Dear Carol - know that you are one with the Universe.
> >
> > Peace - Love Eternal and without judgement - Michael
> **************************************************************
>
> Dear Michael,
>
> What you have said is so beautiful it brought tears to my eyes. You have
> quoted what I have been trying to say, although I say it very badly. Spirit
> is everything. And yes, we are Jesus, Buddha, Yogananda... all things.. and
> God/Godess.
>
> Many, Many Blessings and Love! Carol
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 17:17:32 -0800
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <MystressATnospamkundalini-gateway.org>
> Subject: Re: Through the eyes of another
>
> At 04:42 PM 1/20/01, Carol C. wrote:
>
> >My last reply! I'm done. Great cheer from the list. Fare thee well.
>
> <shrug> You will do what you will do. It is a discussion list, you
> sparked a lot of discussion, thank you for that. No-one has said that you
> need to leave... nor will anyone stop you, regret your leaving, or cheer
> your departure, as you suggest.
>
> You are thinking that we do not understand you.. that is not so..
> Those who responded to your posts have all been at the place where you are.
> It is a natural phase of K. that everyone goes through. It is you who do
> not understand us.
>
> There is a higher perspective that comes later.. regrettably, it cannot
> be communicated well, in words. It is experiential.. and when the time is
> right, you will have experiences and then you will understand what we have
> been trying to tell you. Just as you could not understand the holy books
> before, and now you understand them better.
>
> We are all at different places on the path, and one place is not
> "better" than the other, any more than a child is better than an adult, or
> an adult is better than a teenager.. an old oak is not "better" than a
> sapling, or an acorn. They are simply different stages of growth, and every
> step is necessary. All is perfection.
> Blessings!
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 03:15:26 -0000
> From: "Michael Read" <mareadATnospamix.netcom.com>
> Subject: Pearls
>
> Pearls
>
> The tears you shed
> Lie as pearls upon the grass.
>
> Turning back to glance
> Seeing where you've been
> Your pearls lie there
> In the endless dew.
>
> A string of beauty lost
> Among all the pearls
> Dropped in laughter and pain
> In the garden of reality
> On the dawning of your day
> Your day of awakening.
>
> Now the early dawn holds promise
> In the shimmering air of your dream
> The light strikes out and across
> The dewdrops shout with joy
> You shout with laughter
> A crow calls out just to join your heart
> A smile is on your lips
> Knowing you've never left your home!
>
> >From - The Awakening Heart - Mu
>
> Peace - Michael
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:55:37 -0600
> From: "percyval" <percyvalATnospamrcn.com>
> Subject: Re: Through the eyes of another
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Christopher Wynter <anundaATnospamone.net.au>
> > a "quotable quote"
> >
> > >>> And I've gotta say, as a Jew,
> > it never made me feel to good to go into a Catholic church
> > and see the ultimate sign of sacredness
> > is a Jew nailed, bloody and wounded, to a cross.<<<
>
> a wise guy named George Carlin said: "if Jesus was born in the 20th century,
> people would be wearing gold electric chairs hanging from chains on their
> necks..." (paraphrased)
>
> foolingly,
>
> percyval
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 12:04:53 +0800
> From: Ma An-Guo º¨¦wºê <gugusATnospampavo.seed.net.tw>
> Subject: George W. Judas (was: reply about Percyval's answer to Carol's reply to percyval (was: reply to Carol replying to David the Human Mirror ; ) )
>
> (I think I have the subject title about right... if not please excuse me!)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: percyval <percyvalATnospamrcn.com>
> | [and to Kalipadma: thank you for those interesting song lyrics about
> | Judas... I often suspect he is likely one of the best of the 13, who
> | happened to get a bum rap...]
>
> According to the teaching of the Universal Christian Gnostic Movement, Judas
> was indeed the most advanced of the 12 disciples.
>
> Jesus and his friends came to act out the cosmic drama in the physical
> world. Their every action was to be taken symbolically. The problem (? Who's
> speaking about problem?) with the fundamentalists Xtians of this world is
> that they insist on taking the Bible (the version edited by the Catholic
> Church) to the letter.
>
> According o the Gnostic Movement, Jesus' baptism on the Jordan river is
> symbolic of what (is supposed to?) happen when the Kundalini rises all the
> way up the spine for the first time.
>
> The wedding at Kana is Jesus' own wedding with Maria Magdalene, the sacred
> marriage, and the turning of the water into wine is the transmutation of raw
> sexual energy into a higher vibration spiritual energy...
>
> In this cosmic drama, someone had to play the role of the 'bad guy', a role
> difficult to assume since that guy would be blamed for centuries (around 20
> of them) to come... That's why (? always according to the Gnostic Movement)
> Jesus trusted this most important part to his most advanced disciple,
> Judas...
>
> Of course, I don't have any direct experience about all of this.... but this
> somewhat makes sense to me. I have already written how I fell in love with
> Hitler. I equally love the 'power mongers', so why shouldn't I love Judas?
>
> Hitler, Jesus, Judas... they may all be equally enlightened beings...
>
> (what about your new friend: George W. Bush???)
>
> Augustin...
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Tue, 28 Aug 1956 00:22:36 +0000
> From: nancy <nancyATnospamwtp.net>
> Subject: Re: Reply to David Bozzi
>
> Pardon my messed up date. I have an old computer that needs a new
> battery...and a new one is coming my way next week! I LOVE abundance!
>
> > Let us gain some perspective. God is love, compassion, caring, and to feel less than those emotions
> > for others is to be out of touch with the reality of God. Nor can I stand by and watch another
> > suffering without trying to do something to help. To shrug your shoulders and say it is the will of
> > God and not try to help another who is suffering is to be unenlightened. Check out the examples of the
> > enlightened ones; Jesus who healed the sick, Ghandi who gave to the poor, and so many others. These
> > are examples of how we are to regard others; with compassion and caring. If to be enlightened is to be
> > void of love, caring and compassion, then I doubt that those who profess this have any experience with
> > Light, because Light is Love beyond description, and compassion that is overwhelming. This is the true
> > nature of God and your true nature. Do not believe and confuse all you read in books. Whether it is a
> > person's karma that has designated that person to suffer or not, is NOT OUR BUSINESS. But to reach out
> > with love and compassion to the Spirit in every person is our business, because that Spirit in every
> > person is GOD.
> >
> It feels to me that you are trying to learn compassion and empathy. Why
> not start with people on this list? I don't think Ghandi or Jesus would
> have sent this reply.
>
> Does that make you wrong? Nah. You are just where you need to be. Guess
> what? So is everyone else. Including David and Angelique and the witches
> heading for the hills.
>
> I think that we all come into life with a purpose. Maybe yours is to
> learn how to share with those less fortunate than you. That's wonderful!
> Have at it. My suggestion would be to spend you time doing instead of
> lamenting all the lazy asses in the world that don't want to help.
> Mother Theresa was too busy helping to have time to B*tch.
>
> Just because helping others through sacrifice is your purpose doesn't
> mean it's everyone elses. Why not let everyone be who they are? Isn't
> that the essence of love? Acceptance?
>
> I am truly sorry about your financial struggles. I had some rough years
> myself. I think at that time I was trying to live "spiritually" and
> assuming that the money would take care of itself. That's where I
> goofed. I have changed...I now follow my spiritual path while paying
> attention to what's going on with my life in this world. I like driving
> a car without dents and rust. I like living in a house without fear that
> I'm going to be evicted. I like going out to eat at my favorite
> restaurant and treating two other people. If I had no money tomorrow,
> I'd still be OK. But having been in both positions, I prefer having the
> cash.
>
> ____________________
> ____________________
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