To: K-list
Recieved: 2000/03/05 01:25
Subject: SV: [K-list] dominance, submission, equality
From: Lisa Meyler
On 2000/03/05 01:25, Lisa Meyler posted thus to the K-list:
From: "Lisa Meyler" <elisaveta.meylerATnospamswipnet.se>
Well... I´m sorry you (Angelique) don´t seem to have any experience of the
kind of equality I was talking about. It does exist. And I´m sorry you seem
to meet a lot of stress and having to deal with difficulites in what you´re
doing. I hope your telling me to 'go fuck myself' relieved some of that.
And I´m not being ironic. I´m not judging you at all. I was giving my view
on the subject. And slaps on the head is what you get sometimes if you
stick your nose out. You´re welcome to it.
Lisa Meyler
elisaveta.meylerATnospamswipnet.se
http://home.swipnet.se/reality_center
> From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
>
> Full moon ranting/tough love: If you are having a bad day, delete
now..
>
>
> At 05:45 AM 3/5/00 +0100, Lisa Meyler wrote:
> >From: "Lisa Meyler" <elisaveta.meylerATnospamswipnet.se>
> >
> >Hello all
> >About the ongoing discussion on kundalini or enlightenment or whatever
> websites between Laura and
> >Angelique. It always amazes me to see how so called 'enlighted' people,
or
> people on that road, are
> >dealing with ego issues (which that discussion was all about as I see
it)
> just like everyone else.
> Well, everything you see, is filtered thru your own perceptions, so
it
> is reflection of who you are... I did not see it as an ego issue.
>
> Laura saw it as a competition issue, altho she sidestepped those
> accusations she made, in her second response, and did not explain why she
> felt the need to get so defensive.. but that is not what it was about,
for
> me. I was genuinely curious about why she is creating a Web magazine when
> she says she has too little time and money to offer, and whether she has
> any interest in the lists, besides as a resource to troll for
contributions
> to her own project.
>
> Part of my interest, is at the moment I am embarked on a project that
is
> so huge and expensive, that if I really understood what I am getting
myself
> into, my head would probably explode. Fortunately, I don't. I'm taking it
> one leap of faith, at a time.
>
> There is a kind of equality that comes of the barter of taking and
> giving back. Using the lists without contributing to the discussions,
seems
> unbalanced, to me. I have been watching her do it for many months, and
> finally it seemed time to ask about her motives. I never really did get a
> straight answer, either..
>
> You probably have not seen too many of her posts, as you have only
been
> a member, for a month.. but I have been watching her, ever since she
> started her website.. sorry, web*magazine*. She sends identical posts to
> three of the lists I run, regularly, but I have yet to see her contribute
> to the discusions, at all. Is that equality and teamwork? The purpose of
> the lists, is a discussion forum, not a place for webmasters to go
trolling
> for material.
>
> Do a search on "spirituality" sometime.. or on "realization". There
are
> thousands of spiritual websites on the net. (www.spiritweb.org is the
> biggest, and my favorite) If they all decided to write to the K-lists
and
> ask for contributions, I'd have to shut the lists down because they would
> become totally useless, as a discussion forum.. just as the newsgroups
> became useless, when the spammers moved in.
>
> I have been tempted to shut the lists down, on several occasions,
> anyways, because everytime I do my job and ask people to respect the list
> guidelines, I get people like *you* who think it is a good excuse to make
> judgments about my spiritual evolution and my sexual orientation. At
this
> point, my patience is rather thin, and I would *like* to tell you to go
> fuck yourself.
>
> However, in respect to your sensitivities, and to be properly
> "spiritual", I will instead, politely suggest you go "explore solo
rituals
> of the cult of the feminine". :)
>
> Frankly, I think your expectations of enlightenment are unreasonable,
> and inhuman. Even Christ lost his temper one day, and cursed a fig tree
to
> *death*, because it did not give him what he wanted. We don't lose our
> emotions with enlightenment, we remain human. Personally, I think that is
> beautiful, because if awakening was gonna make me into an unfeeling
robot,
> then I wouldn't want any.
>
> I am not Christ, I have spent half the day trying to be civilized to
men
> who write to me, expecting me to suck a horse's penis for their
amusement,
> because someone is using my name and email address to disseminate
> beastiality porn in chatrooms. I am trying to be patient with them,
because
> I understand they are victims, pawns in some unknown woman's war on my
> reputation. However, this has been going on for 2 years, and my
detachment
> is worn pretty thin.
>
> >Sometimes a lot MORE so than just 'plain people' who wouldn´t know what
> 'enlightenment' meant if
> >you asked them, but who might act in a much more enlightened way than
> people claiming to know a lot
> >about that.
> Well, if you are fit to judge how you think an "enlightened" person,
> "should" behave, then apparently you are more enlightened than all of us.
> Please explain what is so "enlightened" about putting people down because
> they don't fit with your ego's idealism?
>
> > It seems to be very difficult to learn to live and let live, to give
> others space,
> Is that what you are doing, by judging the discussion between Laura
> and me as egoistic and unenlightened??
>
> >to
> >enjoy other peoples success and wish them well, to let people grow
beyond
> yourself and enjoy their
> >progress, to stop the play of dominance and submission
>
> Where was the dominance and submission, in our discusion??? Is every
> discussion about dominance and submission, to you??
> Would you be choosing those words if you did not know I am a
Domin8rex?
> Did you also know that I am an activist for sexual freedom? Dominance is
my
> nature, do you think it is "live and let live" to tell me I should be
> different than Goddess made me? Don't you think it is Dominance, to judge
> me? You bet it is, sweetheart.. don't pretend it isn't. However, true to
my
> nature, I'm not gonna submit to it.
>
> >and turn it into true equality.
>
> Well, I think that is naive. Even the roles of Guru and devotee, are
> about Dominance and submission.
> Humans are herd creatures that always end up playing hierarchy games,
> no matter how "enlightened" they get. Goddess made us like that, because
> hierarchies are necessary for teamwork, and teamwork is necessary to fuse
a
> group into a single focus that can accomplish more than a single person
> can. Whether it is a corporation, an anthill, or a football team.
> Every attempt at an egalitarian society has only ended up creating
> more elaborately ritualized hierarchies, and that goes for the USA and
the
> USSR, both.
> Hierarchies are a part of nature. Human nature. Even birds and
plants
> are territorial, and they compete for resources... even tho they don't
have
> egos. Anyone who has ever weeded a garden, knows this. Nature is not
about
> live and let live, it is an interdependent web of "life eats life". Some
> hierarchies are rigid, like elephant seals, and others are flexible, and
> rotate like geese.. but it's still all about teamwork.
>
> Should Ghandi have wished the British well, and hoped for their
> success when they were taking over his country and using it's people for
> slave labor? The Christians stood aside and let Fascism happen, wished
them
> well, and now the Pope apologises for the sin of inaction.
> Everything is already *equal*. You and me and the rocks and the
trees,
> all made of the same cosmic energy. Equal but different. You cannot make
a
> football team, of all quarterbacks.
>
> So, please do go ahead and rate my "enlightenment" as you like.. my
ego
> can handle it just fine. There is a kind of love that sits and does
> nothing, except criticise from the peanut gallery, and there is another
> kind that has the courage to act.
> If you don't like how this list is run, then you should know there are
> as many "spiritual" lists as there are spiritual websites, perhaps you
can
> find one that will live up to your inhuman expectations. Perhaps you
should
> go to onelist and create your own.
> My "ego" is not interested in catering to your naivete, or your
> judgments of what is "spiritual". I tried to do that, as a list owner for
> years, and I burned out on it. I stopped, because if I hadn't this list
> would no longer exist, for you to criticise. However, I am willing to
give
> you the slap upside the head, that you appear to me, to be asking for. I
am
> quite willing to appear to be an unenlightened egoist, to get through to
you.
> Tough love, from the heart, and Goddess' blessings..
>
>
>
> Mystress Angelique Serpent, http://www.domin8rex.com
> Vancouver, B.C., Canada. Officially the most beautiful city in the
world.
> 8) :D ;) :0 :) ;P ;) :D |* ;) 8D :)
> <<<< I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by
mystery
> <<<< than live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it.
> <<<< -- Harry Emerson Fosdick
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