To: K-list
Recieved: 2000/01/13 18:37
Subject: Digest for kundaliniATnospamtopica.com, issue 26
From: Kundalini
On 2000/01/13 18:37, Kundalini posted thus to the K-list:
-- Topica Digest --
Re: Really wondering
By SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Re: Really wondering
By SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Re: FW: Hunger in the world - donate for FREE!!
By loulou_3ATnospamhotmail.com
RE: Kundalini
By vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi
Re: Really wondering .. Some Answers
By MHortlingATnospamaol.com
Re: Really wondering
By vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi
flu stuff
By LaurelSpringATnospamaol.com
Really wondering -- feedback - Michael
By wynterATnospamone.net.au
Kundalini ... Ville Vainio
By wynterATnospamone.net.au
Really wondering
By mumblecatATnospamangelfire.com
Really Wondering -- flu stuff
By wynterATnospamone.net.au
Really wondering .. Ville Vainio, Jenell, Mystress ...
By wynterATnospamone.net.au
Re: flu stuff
By gillATnospamnimbus.demon.co.uk
Re: [Gill] flu stuff
By wynterATnospamone.net.au
Re: Really wondering
By serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com
Re: Really Wondering -- flu stuff
By serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com
Re: Bananas (Flexibility in the context of (Really wondering))
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
Re: Really wondering
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
Re: Really wondering .. Some Answers
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
Re: Really wondering -- feedback - Michael
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
Re: Really wondering .. Ville Vainio, Jenell, Mystress ...
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
Re: Really wondering
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
Really wondering -Sorry !
By mumblecatATnospamangelfire.com
Re: [Amanda] Really wondering -Sorry !
By wynterATnospamone.net.au
Re: Really wondering
By SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Re: Really Wondering -- flu stuff
By SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Re: Really wondering
By SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Re: Really wondering -Sorry !
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
Re: Really wondering
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net
did everyone get this post of Amanda's?
By serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com
------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:44:13 EST
From: SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
> Yes, into and out of that, lots.
Yes, a certain amount of cursing a certain someone I refer to often....and him laughing in return. :)
Still trying to get used to seeing runes everywhere...
Kimberly
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:51:19 EST
From: SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
> > Count me in too... :)
> >
> What have we got here, an epidemic?!
I've been wondering...other odd things too...I see runes around people and hear their inner voices, when I think its in runic pictures, when I sleep I trance and see runes.....
> and the urge to pop it with no luck for two weeks.
>
> Don't tell me THAT! Mine just started a few days ago!
*shrugs* I guess I shouldn't tell you that that hasn't gone away, then?
> this 'heat' i'm having, it;s not like 'regular' k heat (regular? listen
> to Me! like all this is regular!) It's more like when you've overworked
> a muscle, and you have that burning sensation and aching soreness in it
> later?
Mine is both. :( Perhaps that's what makes it so unbearable to me...K fire alone is fine...muscle burn is yummy to a masochistic soul...both together make a masochist cry.
> Seems to depend on the people at each and how you look to them. One
> place told me i was demon possessed, another seems to want to have me
> around.
They wanted me to come down front and be exorcised...when I opened my crown, they all stood there dumbfounded for about thirty seconds and wanted me to come to god right there.
> just call it a three for all. :)
Hehehe.. :)
> > I've married Hades in the here and now ;) and I'm still here. *grins*
>
> So did I, but I got him over and done with by the time I was 21!
On second thought...it's more like I married Thanatos....the grim reaper. *shrugs* Strange thing is, I love it. :)
Kimberly
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 23:57:28 PST
From: "Marion Hanvey" <loulou_3ATnospamhotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [K-list] FW: Hunger in the world - donate for FREE!!
There's another one as well, like hunger site, but this is for the Orissa
cyclone victims. It works the same as hunger site, one click
saves a life.
www.causeanaffect.org
Love
Loulou
>From: Jasper Buschgens <japsersanATnospamzonnet.nl>
>Reply-To: japsersanATnospamzonnet.nl
>To: kundalini-list k <kundaliniATnospamtopica.com>
>Subject: [K-list] FW: Hunger in the world - donate for FREE!!
>Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 14:47:05 -0800
>
> > Quite clever of the UN to do this. Go to the Hunger Site at the UN.
> > All you do is click a button and somewhere in the world some hungry
>person
> > gets a meal to eat, at no cost to you. The food is paid for by corporate
> > sponsors (who gain advertising in the process because you see their
>logo).
>
> >All you do is go to the site and click. But you're only allowed one
> >click per day. So spread the word to others. Visit the site and pass the
>word.
>
> >http://www.thehungersite.com
> >
> >Not a bad deal.....point, click and feed....spread it around.
>
>Unsubscribe from this list by sending email to:
>kundalini-unsubscribeATnospamtopica.com
>
>_____________________________
>Keep up with breaking news! Join our Hot Topics list.
>http://www.topica.com/lists/breakingnews/t/12
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 12:04:32 +0200 (EET)
From: Ville Vainio <vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi>
Subject: RE: [K-list] Kundalini
On Wed, 12 Jan 2000 CrushinMunchkinsATnospamaol.com wrote:
> I don't understand, the way you have writen this it sounds like Kundalini
> cannot be taught to anyone or by anyone.
That is because k is not something that can be learnt. It's a process that
is either on or off (normally off), it's living with it that requires some
learning. The process is triggered by meditation or "something else".
Someone might teach you a method that just might trigger your k awakening
some day, but that is not exactly teaching k, since k can awaken through
any "efficient" meditation technique.
If someone could reliably awaken k, s/he wouldn't be doing it on open
classes, for obvious juridic reasons.
Ville Vainio - vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi http://www.tp.spt.fi/~vvainio
Wild geese have no intention to cast a reflection
Water has no mind to assume their form
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 05:07:25 EST
From: MHortlingATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering .. Some Answers
Hello Christopher !
Thank you for providing your insights - I've intuitively sensed the link
between experience/memory imprints and stuff happening on the cellular level
in the body, but didn't really have a clear vision of all the possible
parameters involved before.
If official biology and psychology would take up this line of reasoning, at
least as a hypothesis, an important step in the scientific understanding of
the personal reality of humans could be taken. Kundalini could eventually
become a more accepted part of the scientific paradigm as well.
It's interesting to note that the cycles of experience within time you
mention, correspond to the cycle of the planet Saturn, which in astrology
is traditionally linked to the facing of ones deeper karmic patterns.
Maybe other kundalini-people have had this happen as well: Not only does the
shakti bring out memories of past experience but I've sometimes found that
exactly the same outer circumstances appear in my life as in the initial
memory/experience, - only this time there's more awareness as to what the
experience really means and how I react to it. Karmic cycles and the burning
thereof ?
Best regards
Michael
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 12:42:12 +0200 (EET)
From: Ville Vainio <vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi>
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
On Wed, 12 Jan 2000, Jenell wrote:
> that is, are we really talking at all about the same thing when we talk
> of 'k' in context of what is invovled in deliberate practices, yoga
> excercises, breathing excercies, etc, and that which we call spontaneous
> 'k' arousal? More and more i'm really questioning this, for my own and
I believe we are - but making yoga exercises during awakened k might
"drive" the experience to a different direction. It seems that some people
have such a "mild" k that they must meditate to get any experiences.
Sometimes somebody, when asked to describe what k feels like, starts every
observation/symptom with a reference to meditation.
> that of toehrs with spontaeous awakening seem to actually have little in
> common with what those using deliberate practices expereince. I've never
Those in deliberate practises often over-emphasize their distinct
experiences and develop an attachment to them. That gives the tone to
their descriptions.
> 'nectar' dripping from one's palate, talking about feeling k coming up
> oe or another different channel in the spine, I've never had any
> awareness of it specifically coming up my spine at all, never had 'light
For me, the spinal phenomena usually happen when having been "blocked" for
some time, and the spinal "flow" or tingling "dissolves" the feeling of
being blocked.
> paranormal phenomenon, psychic expereiences, experienced transformation
> and enlightment in various ways, and by various means, including
> 'hearing' voices that instruct and teach, sometimes convey information
> aparantly from deceased people even, awareness in various ways of
> 'spiritual entities', spiritual beings, with too much 'verification' of
> their 'presence' to dismiss as just my imagination or hallucinations,
> visions and dreams, 'messages through signs', or synchronicities, etc,
Hmm.... I don't think paranormal phenomena are a manifestation of
enlightenment (that's not probably what you meant, just wanted to clarify
a bit).
> which it seems is not usually a part of the experience of those
> deliberately practicing to 'raise k'. This doesn't seem to be just a
> difference in my cultural way of percieving it, or the words I would
> choose to define/describe, but a different kind of experience, period.
To me it seems that you have a very receptive, "open" nervous system while
many deliberate practitioners have a more "closed", blocked, static,
ego-guided nervous system. Thus, k can do it's work more freely inside you
and therefore you feel it differently. Perhaps that's why it awakened
spontaneously with you in the first place.
> I'm really wondering if we are really talking about two or even more,
> quite diferent phenomen?
I think k is such a complex phenomenon and brain is such a complex device
that it can do pretty much anything, regardless of how we try to
compartmentalize it. We really don't know enough about it. Just when it
starts to feel familiar - boom - something new comes up.
Speeking of "feeling crappy"-epidemic... I have been feeling like that for
a month or so. Now I'm just recovering from a flu, but my hands are still
feeling strange/weak/cold. It's only now that I'm starting to feel the k
returning to the usual bliss-inducing state.
Ville Vainio - vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi http://www.tp.spt.fi/~vvainio
Wild geese have no intention to cast a reflection
Water has no mind to assume their form
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 06:53:45 EST
From: LaurelSpringATnospamaol.com
Subject: flu stuff
Ditto here.... I had to go and mention the Flu in a previous post..LOL
Its been going around of course but this time my body is acting weird..I have
a fever but it feels weird....not like usual. My body is not acting like it
has in the past.
<< Since last Friday I have been getting wild and whacked out symptoms..
> flu symptoms with an emotional quality, feverish and chills,
How odd and coincidental. I have been feeling absolutely AWFUL lately, >>
I stayed home yesterday but will buck up and go in today......life is weird.
Love to all
Fran
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 23:13:33 +1100
From: Christopher Wynter <wynterATnospamone.net.au>
Subject: Really wondering -- feedback - Michael
I would like thank people who have fed back to me their comments and
questions ... and I would like to take this opportunity to answer a few
now. My apologies to anyone (or subjects) I may appear to overlook as I
sort through my "in box"...
______________________
Michael...
> If official biology and psychology would take up this line of reasoning,
at least as a hypothesis, an important step in the scientific understanding
of the personal reality of humans could be taken. Kundalini could
eventually become a more accepted part of the scientific paradigm as well.<
We first I set out to do this work, one of my goals was to find a common
language to bridge the gap between the jargon of biology and psychology and
the mystical terms of spirituality and religion. I have found that we are
all talking the same language, but the general public is getting lost in
the vocabulary. For quite a while now I have adopted for myself the phrase
"a plain man's plain speak" to define the manner of my writing, and my
attempt to find a common language.
The symptoms people write of on this list for experiences that I, to, have
had, and I've had to work through them -- and in order to gain
understanding of my experience have had to move beyond "jargon" to gain
understanding for myself.
The flow on from this is that words have a vibration, a resonance, and it
is this resonance which sets up a "key word index" within the cellular
structure of the physical body, directly linking symptoms of "disruption"
with the resonance of the word.
Therefore as I write, it is possible that my use of specific words could
trigger a physiological reaction or a recognition where "jargon" may bring
no kinesthetic response.
It is from my own experience that you may find, within what I write,
definitions of commonly used expressions which may vary from what the
textbooks told you you should believe.
___________________
Michael...
> but didn't really have a clear vision of all the possible parameters
involved before.<
So far I have only provided an introduction to the possibilities, and it
will be through the feed back from people on this list (with the moderators
blessing) that I will be able to expand into words what I and my group here
in Tasmania have learned from listening to our own bodies.
________________
Christopher Wynter
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 23:37:08 +1100
From: Christopher Wynter <wynterATnospamone.net.au>
Subject: Kundalini ... Ville Vainio
Ville Vainio wrote ...
> That is because k is not something that can be learnt. It's a process
that is either on or off (normally off), it's living with it that requires
some learning. <
_________________________
Can I create a paradigm shift here by suggesting that Kundalini is
something that is always "on".
What requires learning (remembering) is that the "paranormal" or "psychic"
realms of awareness that are available to somebody in full consciousness of
awakened Kundalini is a safe experience.
It is the repression of this state of consciousness
which is that the root of "off" or repressed awareness of Kundalini.
The term I often use is "denial of essence" ...
because expression of expanded consciousness is both unsafe
and has historically been made a "symptom of evil" by the Christian Church.
Much of the cold experienced during so-called "K awakening"
is symptomatic of the the fear of persecution of our ancestors
which was triggered when in our innocence as children,
we saw and heard things, which, when we told our parents,
were often made horribly wrong.
Kundalini is already awakened -- we are in denial of that awakening ..
it is the rememberings of the freedom of our true expression which is
triggered -
something which requires either the original repression to be overcome,
or for us to find the person from whom we need permission,
or us to take back are own power so that we can, in fact
give ourselves permission and move beyond what I term our "denial threshold".
Christopher Wynter
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 12:52:31 0000
From: "winter mute" <mumblecatATnospamangelfire.com>
Subject: Really wondering
On Wed, 12 Jan 2000 16:51:25 Jenell wrote:
>that is, are we really talking at all about the same thing when we talk
>of 'k' in context of what is invovled in deliberate practices, yoga
>excercises, breathing excercies, etc, and that which we call spontaneous
>'k' arousal? More and more i'm really questioning this, for my own and
>that of toehrs with spontaeous awakening seem to actually have little in
>common with what those using deliberate practices expereince. I've never
>had anything like what are called the mudras and kyras, things like
>'nectar' dripping from one's palate, talking about feeling k coming up
>oe or another different channel in the spine,
...
>which it seems is not usually a part of the experience of those
>deliberately practicing to 'raise k'. This doesn't seem to be just a
>difference in my cultural way of percieving it, or the words I would
>choose to define/describe, but a different kind of experience, period.
>
>I'm really wondering if we are really talking about two or even more,
>quite diferent phenomen?
Hi Jenell,
Since you are wondering...
and asking the entire list;
I can only give you my personal view on this...
from experience...
Everybody perceives the experience of
Kundalini differently.
It does not matter.
Kundalini is a manifestation of the all
encompassing Shakti, which is Shiva in
movement... which is Everything.
So your questions is difficult to answer.
Simply try and let things unfold by itself.
But I detect more subtle layers in your
question. Are you looking for affirmation ?
I wrote a lot the past days and you seem to have
specifially homed in on my posts in your
question, therefore:
I can only speak for myself, but
nothing of what I write about is "deliberate"
or "technical" in the sense that it has been
taught or is sought after.
In this life I know next to
nothing of formal meditation and have not
been taught it. In this effect, I do not
do any meditation.
I was also never taught
any mantra chanting, or energy / chakra work
or yoga at all and have a slight allergy to
altars and things like that, and hence do not
perform offerings or chant, meaning I do not
have any puja and in effect, no proper spiritual
practice.
I also have a slight guru allergy due to some
unfortunate experiences with gurus of the
past and so do not
have a guru in the ordinary sense either.
But the process takes care of itself and so the
energy is my guru.
According to some books, no guru,
no puja, no spiritual
practice should equal no good experiences
with K.
However, the energy allotted to me
is greedy, wilful and extremely
aggressive, a
fire path, and so it does what it does and
moves without much help at all.
By letting the energy work on its own,
there were suddenly chakras, all seven and more,
there were suddenly mudras and
spontaneous yoga postures,
enough to keep me occupied all night long
for a year,
there was suddenly one-pointedness of the mind
and meditation on emptiness, often
described and promoted in literature.
After K became overt, I was drawn to various
books, first to try and know more, then to
see that the various experiences passed by
to a large extent compared with what is
described in the books.
Of course, not everything is similar and not
everything the books describe have I experienced
and vice versa.
These books were written by someone and they had
their views and interpretations of it.
When wanting to communicate, one needs a
language and I thought using the language of
the books would be a good thing.
That's why words like mudra and chakra
and susumna are used.
Don't worry about what others are saying,
use your own words to describe what is happening,
if you want to.
Best regards,
Amanda.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 00:01:13 +1100
From: Christopher Wynter <wynterATnospamone.net.au>
Subject: Really Wondering -- flu stuff
At 10:54 PM 13/01/00 , Fran wrote:
>Ditto here.... I had to go and mention the Flu in a previous post..LOL
>Its been going around of course but this time my body is acting weird..I have
>a fever but it feels weird....not like usual. My body is not acting like it
>has in the past.
>
><< Since last Friday I have been getting wild and whacked out symptoms..
> > flu symptoms with an emotional quality, feverish and chills,
>
> How odd and coincidental. I have been feeling absolutely AWFUL lately, >>
It is written that if there wasn't any rain, there wouldn't be any rainbows.
How many times in the past have we repressed tears
because it was either unsafe or unacceptable to cry.
It is a learned limiting belief that tears are an expression of grief, pain
and suffering.
Tears are also expression of joy and freedom.
Just because we do not actually allow the tears to flow from our eyes
does not mean that the release of expression has not taken place ---
it is the tears that have been repressed
along with the associated "keywords" and symptoms.
How much effort and energy is required to hold back a flood?
Hence the pain is the release of that energy.
If, in nature, if a stream is blocked so that it forms pools,
how long does it take before the pool become stagnant...
And what are the characteristics (symptoms) of a stagnant pool...
The repression of tears within the physical body creates stagnant pools ..
The energy to block the stream is remembered as pain ...
the symptom of the un-blocking has been labelled by the medical profession
as "flu" ...
And the appropriate medical means of dealing with this, for the child,
is often associated with trauma ... how often does the medicine taste
aweful ...
Underneath and within the stagnant pool
lies the remembering of the flowing stream ...
Cleansing the stagnant pool is most easily accomplished
by increasing the flow of water to flush out the accumulated toxicity...
and by giving permission for the stream to flow again by seeking out the
dam .. and removing the accumulated sticks and leaves and silt ...
somewhere in the midst of it will be one stick that got stuck ...
caught on some hidden snag....
Christopher Wynter
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 00:32:50 +1100
From: Christopher Wynter <wynterATnospamone.net.au>
Subject: Really wondering .. Ville Vainio, Jenell, Mystress ...
At 09:42 PM 13/01/00 , you wrote:
>but making yoga exercises during awakened k might
>"drive" the experience to a different direction.
yes
>It seems that some people
>have such a "mild" k that they must meditate to get any experiences.
My suggestion is to practice for the practice..
if there is a purpose to the practice,
then the outcome will be the experience of what you expected ...
and you will be disappointed if it is not
>Sometimes somebody, when asked to describe what k feels like, starts every
>observation/symptom with a reference to meditation.
Meditation is, in its true expression, the art of doing nothing
and being everything ...
Meditation for a purpose (seeking) will provide an outcome
limited by preconceptions (and the limitations of words and language
to the key words stored in the body
>Those in deliberate practises often over-emphasize their distinct
>experiences and develop an attachment to them. That gives the tone to
>their descriptions.
yes
>For me, the spinal phenomena usually happen when having been "blocked" for
>some time, and the spinal "flow" or tingling "dissolves" the feeling of
>being blocked.
and you were the one who was blocking or denying yourself ..
a learned behavioural response to perceived external threat ..
usually to survival or approval ...
> > paranormal phenomenon, psychic expereiences, experienced transformation
> > and enlightment in various ways, and by various means, including
> > 'hearing' voices that instruct and teach, sometimes convey information
> > aparantly from deceased people even, awareness in various ways of
> > 'spiritual entities', spiritual beings, with too much 'verification' of
> > their 'presence' to dismiss as just my imagination or hallucinations,
> > visions and dreams, 'messages through signs', or synchronicities, etc,
>
>Hmm.... I don't think paranormal phenomena are a manifestation of
>enlightenment (that's not probably what you meant, just wanted to clarify
>a bit).
oh yes they are ...
enlightenment is bringing to the light of daily consciousness
all of those things that have been running you ..
down in your subconscious and unconscious
denied .. without your even having been aware of their existance ..
Transpersonal Psychology refers to this area as the
"Transpersonal Bands"
Hinduism refers to the "siddhis"
both suggesting that these are obstacles which should be
passed through as quickly as possible .. and the easiest way
to pass through them is not to make them wrong ....
This is also my experience ... within me were the voices of the lost ..
characters and roles played,
denied, repressed, not heard, not allowed to speak, feared, trusted, ...
both from this lifetime .. and also voices of long dead ancestors
who spoke in languages familiar to my body
but foreign to my mind ....
> > which it seems is not usually a part of the experience of those
> > deliberately practicing to 'raise k'.
yes
>This doesn't seem to be just a
> > difference in my cultural way of percieving it, or the words I would
> > choose to define/describe, but a different kind of experience, period.
perceptions and language of the perceiver .. and the need for recognition
and acceptance behind the description given ...
in other words .. who was the target audience of the description,
and what was the effect sought by the describer ...
please, Jenell, don't put yourself down ... or make your experience wrong ...
maybe you just don't have the (subconscious/unconscious)
>To me it seems that you have a very receptive, "open" nervous system while
>many deliberate practitioners have a more "closed", blocked, static,
>ego-guided nervous system.
yes
>Thus, k can do it's work more freely inside you
>and therefore you feel it differently. Perhaps that's why it awakened
>spontaneously with you in the first place.
or was not as repressed as it is in many others ...
my experience is that in the majority of "seekers", the stronger the
thrust for seeking, the greater the level of denial ..
and the most traumatic the experience ...
I experienced trauma during my initial seeking .. and with the allowing
the pain of the release gave way to periods of tension immediately followed
by a great release ....
> > I'm really wondering if we are really talking about two or even more,
> > quite diferent phenomen?
nope .. but there are many perceptions .. depending on the teacher
or the book you read .. and the filter set of beliefs
that the learning was absorbed through ...
>I think k is such a complex phenomenon
Is freedom complex ... or is freedom foreign to conscious remembering
and thus to be feared ...
>and brain is such a complex device
>that it can do pretty much anything, regardless of how we try to
>compartmentalize it. We really don't know enough about it. Just when it
>starts to feel familiar - boom - something new comes up.
.... or something old comes up to be released which we translate into the
language of our preconceptions .. to make something out of ..
and then we get grabbed by it ..
one of my expressions ..
did you have the thought
or did the thought have you ...
> It's only now that I'm starting to feel the k
>returning to the usual bliss-inducing state.
otherwise known as self induced mesmerism ..
with truly awakened K and full awareness of "all there is"
there are no thoughts, feelings and emotions ...
only the choice of the experience
Christopher Wynter
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 13:58:13 -0000
From: "Gill Collingwood" <gillATnospamnimbus.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [K-list] flu stuff
me too!
I've been feeling rough mentally for about a week; I figured it was
delayed-onset SAD! It's going now, thank god... I've been unable to
get down to work, and was feeling slightly suicidal for a day or two.
I told my clients that I couldn't meet their deadlines cos I had flu,
which was a lie (I've just had a slight cold) but it made life easier!
Anyway, I feel a lot better knowing it's not just me, I can't blame
myself so much for it.
btw, the recent discussion of allergies to antibiotics reminded me
of the way I suddenly became allergic to penicillin (and also felt
very bad whilst on another antibiotic, which I've since been able to
tolerate). New allergies are very common during and immediately
after pregnancy; I wonder if there's a similar mechanism involved?
gill
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 01:28:15 +1100
From: Christopher Wynter <wynterATnospamone.net.au>
Subject: Re: [Gill] flu stuff
>btw, the recent discussion of allergies to antibiotics reminded me
>of the way I suddenly became allergic to penicillin (and also felt
>very bad whilst on another antibiotic, which I've since been able to
>tolerate). New allergies are very common during and immediately
>after pregnancy; I wonder if there's a similar mechanism involved?
in short .. yes ..
but this opens up a whole new discussion on pregnancy
where there is an unconscious physiological reminder to the physical body
of the state of full awakened Kundalini and a remembering
within the cells of the body going back before the bipolar androgyne
(before separation into separate male and female)
to ultimately, the asexual being which was the manifestation
(via processes I wrote previously about) of separation from
what we sometimes call God ...
During pregnancy, the unconscious memories are awakened
of being neither male nor female .. and giving birth to the split from
self ... the hormone levels, when you go deeply into it ..
are "symptomatic" of a monopolar being ..
BTW .. male experience of the partners pregnancy
is also accompanied with a change in hormone levels and
composition to very similar to the pregnant female .. and from
my own experience also, the male body carries the memory
deep in the unconscious of giving birth .. and suckling ...
The actual birthing process .. and the accompanying
post natal depression is a triggering of the genetic
memory of the separation firstly
of male and female (androgyne) from the asexual
and later male and females as separate sexes from the androgyne.
the umbilical cord is the remembering of this joining ...
and premature severing of this cord will cause trauma for both
the mother and the new born ... this is a memory which can be recalled ..
and I have found is passed on through the DNA memory.
The Birthing process itself is awakening Kundalini ..
and birth pain, when traced, has been shown to be
rooted in the restrictions in the pelvis and sacrum due to
past memories and experiences in the genetic line.
I have been the midwife at several births
where "active K" (for want of a better term)
was used as the birthing energy ..
and the mothers experienced
no pushing, no contractions, and no pain ...
there was however the spontaneous sounding of various tones ...
which no-one present could imitate ...
but which brought everyone in the room to tears, and
set every dog in the neighborhood howling ...
>gill
Christopher
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 05:44:50 -0800
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
At 10:09 PM 1/12/00 -0800, Jenell wrote:
>SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com wrote:
>>
>> Count me in too... :)
>>
>What have we got here, an epidemic?!
Um.. before I mentioned being ill on this list, a quick survey of
friends and another list rounded up about a dozen folks or more who've
suffered.. it's a spiritual flu.. yes, a planetwide epidemic. Misery loves
company. :)
>and the urge to pop it with no luck for two weeks.
Pop what?
>The heat has been unbearable.
I'm loving the heat.. the heat is stable and relaxed.. it's the vibe of
the chills that's had me concerned for my mind.. I'm not noticing pain..
getting endorphins instead, probably.. but the hypersensitivity and the
mood swings .. oy.
>Seems to depend on the people at each and how you look to them. One
>place told me i was demon possessed, another seems to want to have me
>around.
I find it is the same. So much that I'm kind of a hermit... I think
that to folks who want to grow and open to spirit, Shakti feels yummy..
those that don't want to grow, it pushes on their resistance uncomfortably
and they blame/project it at the source ..Brides of Hades, we carry the
vibration of death. The wise know it is the doorway to the light, to
rebirth and they draw closer but the fearful turn away cursing the demons.
Blessings..
Mystress Angelique Serpent, http://www.domin8rex.com
Vancouver, B.C., Canada. Officially the most beautiful city in the world.
8) :D ;) :0 :) ;P ;) :D |* ;) 8D :)
<<<< I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery
<<<< than live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it.
<<<< -- Harry Emerson Fosdick
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 05:42:20 -0800
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really Wondering -- flu stuff
At 04:58 AM 1/13/00 -0800, Christopher Wynter wrote:
>How much effort and energy is required to hold back a flood?
>Hence the pain is the release of that energy.
Tears come easily, but it wasn't till Kimberly complained about pain
that I realized I'm not getting any.. if I pinch myself, it doesn't hurt at
all.. One of my beloveds tuned into me and got massive neck pain that
brought tears to her eyes.. but I just feel stiff. It's making me wonder if
the loss of appetite and nausea might be from pain I'm not feeling... I
appreciate the merciful anaestesia, wherever it's coming from..
Blessings..
Mystress Angelique Serpent, http://www.domin8rex.com
Vancouver, B.C., Canada. Officially the most beautiful city in the world.
8) :D ;) :0 :) ;P ;) :D |* ;) 8D :)
<<<< I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery
<<<< than live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it.
<<<< -- Harry Emerson Fosdick
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 00:51:38 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com, serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com, kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: Bananas (Flexibility in the context of (Really wondering))
Jacques de Schryver et Linda Steven wrote:
>
> Jenell asked :
> > Are they anything like bananas? gosh, I don't know all these Hindu terms! what's an
> asana?
> Jenell
>
> Hello Jenell,
>
> Sorry,
>
> It is simply positions ;-))), as opposed to breathing
> (pranayama). Locks are called bandas (for getting right
> pressure at the right place). With these few words, you know
> as much as I do ;-))).
>
> No less, no more.
>
> Froggy
>
some questions:
> --Something like finding and applying pressure to trigger points in accupressure or massage therapy? Except to affect the k energies system instead of the neuromuscular?
Would these points be more likely to be along or on/in the spine
itself, or relative to the area of whatever chakra might be invoved?
Considering upon Magna's post about crucifixtion/ressurection, and what
I told of in my own post about the dream about the pit, etc, add that
also about that time I had two dark spots come up on my face, little
skin tumors, almost exactly matching, on each side of my forehead, just
above my temples, and I had them surgically removed, and now, I have a
little lump or knot, about the size of a pea, within the skin on my
throat, right at the fold where the chin joins the throat, would it be
likely that where I need to focus effort in related to my throat chakra?
I don't think this little lump is a tumor, but something a little cyst,
i've had a chronic thing there for quite a few years, it would fill with
white goo like a little blackhead, like just an oen pore in the skin,
would have to squeeze it out from time to time, but now, it's as if it
is sealed within the skin tissue, I can't even find an aparant 'head' to
it to try to squeeze it out. Not painful or anything, just annoying. And
while I've aways had something of a contralto voice when I sing, lately,
it is somewhat more rough, hoarse sounding.
If you put 'bandas' and 'asanas' togther, it really does come out
something like bananas, doesn't it? Interesting, curious, one of my kids
had a probelm pronouncing 'bananas' correcty, still as an adult slips
and says it wrong sometimes, and I'm sure the rest of us haven't helped
her in that, since we all thought it sounded so cute that way, I and
other family members still sometimes call that fruit by that, instead of
it's correct name. She would say it as 'bandandas'.
Thanks for the desire to help.
Jenell
> Jacques De Schryver et Linda Steven
> http://jdsetls.virtualave.net/Kundalini/kundalini.html
> http://members.xoom.fr/jdsetls/
> http://jdsetls.citeglobe.com/index.html
> http://www.home.ch/~spaw9019/cours.html
> http://www.i-france.com/jdsetls/
> http://www.multimania.com/jdsetls/Surfeur_Fou/NOF_3.0/nof_3.0.html
> http://www.multimania.com/jdsetls/MHR/html/lois_et_proverbes.html
> http://www.multimania.com/jdsetls/html/carrefour.html
> Site de Linda : http://www.multimania.com/lsteven
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:01:49 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com wrote:
>
>
> On second thought...it's more like I married Thanatos....the grim reaper. *shrugs* Strange thing is, I love it. :)
>
> Kimberly
Oh, he was my second husband. Got him over and done with, too. Haven't
yet quite firgured who I've married this time. We doj't usually ifure
that out until we got past that glow of the blindness of the delusions
of love, you know. That's why we can see who they were in after the
fact, but not before, and wonder how we could ever been so 'wrong' about
somebody like that, not seen them as they 'really are' before we married
them! I think that's because we choose them according to what we need to
overcome within ourself, and if we had out wits about us at the time,
we'd never choose to do that!
But then, of course, we are something of the same kind of thing to them,
in some way, too, so that sort of makes us feel a little humble about
those kinds of seemingly 'bad matches', about trying to lay all the
'blame' on them and see ourselves as some kind of innocent darling
victims.
Jenell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:09:57 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering .. Some Answers
MHortlingATnospamaol.com wrote:
>
>
> Maybe other kundalini-people have had this happen as well: Not only does the
> shakti bring out memories of past experience but I've sometimes found that
> exactly the same outer circumstances appear in my life as in the initial
> memory/experience, - only this time there's more awareness as to what the
> experience really means and how I react to it. Karmic cycles and the burning
> thereof ?
>
> Best regards
>
> Michael
>
Wow, have i EVER! YES! That was strongly evident early on, it was as if
situations of past traumas were 're-occuring' in and around me in some
way, lots of symbol connected, and yes, definitely not just my own mind
'remebering' it, but events playing out around me and in my life that
were 're-creating' the traumatic event, triggering in me the opening of
memories of not only the event, but the emotional/phsycoligcal imapct on
me!
I recognized this at some point, and with that recognition, also
realized the 'purpose' of it, was to cause me to in a sense 'relive'
those events, those traumas, that I didn't deal with before, so i could
get worked through thenm now. Once i realized that, I began to take an
active role in it, see it as something like the shmanic principle of
'energy retrieval', going into those things, events, to retrieve the
energy I have been wasting on them, and retrieve parts of myself that i
had lost during those traumas.
By the way, anyone ever thought on the coincidental similarity of the
words 'relive', and 'relieve'?
Jenell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:28:59 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering -- feedback - Michael
Christopher Wynter wrote:
>
> We first I set out to do this work, one of my goals was to find a common
> language to bridge the gap between the jargon of biology and psychology and
> the mystical terms of spirituality and religion. I have found that we are
> all talking the same language, but the general public is getting lost in
> the vocabulary. For quite a while now I have adopted for myself the phrase
> "a plain man's plain speak" to define the manner of my writing, and my
> attempt to find a common language.
>
>I think some serious work in the direction of finding the commonality within the various languages and cultures, as well as psychology and biology, is really needed. In myown expereience, I have found things that 'resonnte' with me, trigger 'recognition' to being as my own expereiences, in everything from the limited bit of Hindu teachings I encounter, shamanism in various cultures, Christian mysticism, Budhism, on and on. All are talking about the same things, but in words that culture and language had to use to describe/define. Also, the very way we 'expereience' a thing, the same thing, the same 'event', varies widely according to our social/cultural/ personal life experience conditioning. Consider that as to how it relates to even seemingly simply, ordinary things, those 'conditioned' to stroicly bear a lot of pain, as compared to those conditioned to make a big deal out of every little bruise and scratch. I have by life been conditioned to bearing a lot of pain, both phy!
sically and emotionally, and to do so quietly and with little outward indcation of it, that it is sometimes difficult to not be annoyed at someone just laid out by something that to me is a relatively minor little annoyance. I've realized that some of what i've expereienced through this k experience and came through in relatively good condition, would have totally laid out a lot of people, physcially, emotionally, and mentally.
We also 'attach' emotionalism to things that are physcial, as I've
observed in such as how people react to animal bites. I have always been
oriented toward working with animals, am a dog groomer. My hands and
arms are a cross hatch of scars from the bites and scratches. If I'm
bitten, I just wash it good, assess and attend to whatever level of
medical care is neccessary for it, and keep right on working. No big
deal. I've tried to point out to others how over blown their reactions
are to bite wounds that are no more than what they might get tangling
with a barbed wire fence or closing the car door on their fingers, yes,
it hurts, but for their having made other attachments to an animal bite,
they make it some big traumatic event. I mean by this that there are
many people that actually 'blame' their extreme 'phobia' of dogs on
something like a single bite incident, often a rather trival one, at
that, and they are sure that is a 'normal' response. I ask them, would
it be 'normal' to become that afraid of cars for having once smashed
your fngers in a closing car door? Much of this happens, gets carried
down generations, in a way, of course by those around a child or even
adult, themselves reacting in an over blown way. but all of us have such
difference in the way we percive even the very same things like this.
Jenell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 02:33:48 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering .. Ville Vainio, Jenell, Mystress ...
This thread is turning out VERY helpful to me, thank you for your
involvment in it, all that have contributed, but most especially to
Christopher. BTW, Christopher, very likely relevant to my own
'experience' is that I did have a 'death experience', though at a very
young age, wasn't told about it until just a few years ago, though I'd
always had some memories surrounding the event that I had not been able
to 'place'. When the stuff abut NDE first began to be shown on TV, at
first, just hearing others talk about it, (not then knowing that had
happened to me) I didn't pay much attention. But I still remember the
evening that there was a 'dramatization' of that experience shown on TV,
the 'going into the light', etc, and my reaction was so powerful, of
'recogition', I KNEW that experience, but didn't know how or why I
should have.
now, on to some of the things in this particular post. Since more than
one of us are batting this thig around, I'm going to start prefacing my
parts with (J) to try to minmize confusion over who said what.
Christopher Wynter wrote:
>
>
> >but making yoga exercises during awakened k might
> >"drive" the experience to a different direction.
>
> yes (J) that makes sense.
>
>
> My suggestion is to practice for the practice..
> if there is a purpose to the practice,
> then the outcome will be the experience of what you expected ...
> and you will be disappointed if it is not
(J) Yes, this I really picked up understanding of, not only in realtion
to meditation or K, but in most we do, that to focus on outcome, even
have an outcome in mind, is to close the door to possiblities.
>
>
> Meditation for a purpose (seeking) will provide an outcome
> limited by preconceptions (and the limitations of words and language
> to the key words stored in the body
(J) I try to overcoe/avoid this by trying o cultivate what i've heard
called, 'just sitting', or 'just seeing', observing without judgment of
what one is observing, waiting for what it will reveal to me by itself.
>
>
>
> >For me, the spinal phenomena usually happen when having been "blocked" for
> >some time, and the spinal "flow" or tingling "dissolves" the feeling of
> >being blocked.
During the many years of my adult life in which i was suppressing all
this, having been quite 'open' as a child, I sufferred sevre,
debiltating muscle spasms, beyond what any physical condition of my
spine explained. For over 20 yrs, muscle relaxants and pain releivers,
and often antidepressants, had been part of my daily diet. With my Re
awakening, they (the severe spasms) just dissolved away. In fact, a part
of what seemed to trigger my re awakening is having become so servely
debilitated with sciatic problems, and finding a really skilled massage
therapist i later learened is herself k awakened, and a energy healer,
she had in a few months, got me over that, and it was rwally the
beginning of all the spasm problem going away.
>
> and you were the one who was blocking or denying yourself ..
> a learned behavioural response to perceived external threat ..
> usually to survival or approval ...
(J) Very definitely! I recongnize this, can see in my chuldhood how and
when it happened.
>
>
> >
> >Hmm.... I don't think paranormal phenomena are a manifestation of
> >enlightenment (that's not probably what you meant, just wanted to clarify
> >a bit).
>
> oh yes they are ...
> enlightenment is bringing to the light of daily consciousness
> all of those things that have been running you ..
(J) Yes, that is exactly how i would put it myself. As it is by it's
very nature an expansion of awareness, it is very much a part of
enlightenment.
>
>
> both from this lifetime .. and also voices of long dead ancestors
> who spoke in languages familiar to my body
> but foreign to my mind ....
>
> > > which it seems is not usually a part of the experience of those
> > > deliberately practicing to 'raise k'.
>
> yes
>
(J) Because of that concept of 'outcome', and pre-determined
'expectation', we have in such a deliberate effort?
>
> perceptions and language of the perceiver .. and the need for recognition
> and acceptance behind the description given ...
> in other words .. who was the target audience of the description,
> and what was the effect sought by the describer ...
(J) makes sense.
> please, Jenell, don't put yourself down ... or make your experience wrong ...
(J) I don't think that i am. Of course, that could be there as a part of
my self deceptions, couldn't it?
> maybe you just don't have the (subconscious/unconscious)
(J) Not sure what you mean here. For/of what?
>
> >To me it seems that you have a very receptive, "open" nervous system while
> >many deliberate practitioners have a more "closed", blocked, static,
> >ego-guided nervous system.
>
> yes
> (J) I've now gone into some stuff related to spirutual mediums, 'sensivitves' that talk of the 'differences' in the way a medium or sensitives', 'etheric body' is made, and bingo! There was much i had not understood about myself much of my life, and why as ow again open, I suffer, as I did as an open child, much of the pain related to this. In past cultures where mediums were better understood and accepted, it was also accepted that they WERE 'sensitive' and even subject to injury as oter people are not, and it was recongized a need to protect them, shelter them, in some ways. I'm learning about ways in which i can be subject to injury, damage, of my etheric body, that are pecular to mediums, and have reconginized injuries of that sort I've experienced in the past, over my lifetime, and am working on healing those injuries now that I understand what happened to me, and why. In shamanism, it is talke dof hw we can 'lose' parts of ourself, of our soul, in traumaitc events, a!
nd of dong soul and energy retrieval to heal it, those concepts are especially apllicable to one that is a spiritual medium, for that can happen to us in ways beyond that of most people. I've realized that in mudium 'contacts' I actually have a part of my etheric body extended into those 'other realms', for instance, and after each such incident, I must 'come out' by reabsorbing, withdrawing, that part of me that is 'there' back into myself 'here', and a sudden 'breaking of the contact, a 'sudden tearing/breaking away' can actually be like a guillitine, cutting, tearing, a part of my etheric body off, leaving it 'trapped' there.
> >Thus, k can do it's work more freely inside you
> >and therefore you feel it differently. Perhaps that's why it awakened
> >spontaneously with you in the first place.
>
> or was not as repressed as it is in many others ...
>
(J) Probably. But also, i've had much of the repressions through
cultural conditioning ripped away from me in my life, in having
experienced traumatic events in my life, finding myself the one society
'rejects' on the basis of repressed beleifs, and when oe has experienced
being the 'unacceptable', one can no longer accept the prejudices
against them. By having myself been made to be an outcast under those
repressions of our society and culture, I had to reject the basis of
them.
> my experience is that in the majority of "seekers", the stronger the
> thrust for seeking, the greater the level of denial ..
> and the most traumatic the experience ...
>
(J) I think what is involved in that is the motivation behind the
seeking. Those seeking from motivation of affirming themselves, and
their accepted position and beleifs, ARE in for some shocks. they are
seeking strongly on 'outcome' and pre-formed expectations.
> I experienced trauma during my initial seeking .. and with the allowing
> the pain of the release gave way to periods of tension immediately followed
> by a great release ....
(J) I'm still experiencing that. Also in the mental sense, my mind will
'clear', then go through what i call 'brain storms', full of static,
difficult to focus and concentrate, then suddenly, clears again, this
time more clear that it was before, each time, it is more clear, my
understandings and perceptions a step further along. But those periods
of confusion, fuzziness, always seem to preceed each 'advance' in my
mental clarity and perceptions. As if I'm taking in new data, pausing to
'rpoces' it, rearrange what was alreayd there to accomadate it, then it
'clears', and it starts all over gain. I've likened it to my brain, my
entire mind, being re-programmed, being swithed over, upgraded, from an
old program, to a new, more comlex one, and it has to be done in step
stages.
>
> > > I'm really wondering if we are really talking about two or even more,
> > > quite diferent phenomen?
>
> nope .. but there are many perceptions .. depending on the teacher
> or the book you read .. and the filter set of beliefs
> that the learning was absorbed through ...
>
(J) I think the crux of what I'm questioning is that for some, it seems
an experienc percive mostly on a physical experience level, for me, it
has been largely mental/emotional level.
> >I think k is such a complex phenomenon
>
(J) No doubt.
> one of my expressions ..
> did you have the thought
> or did the thought have you ...
(J) YES! A form of being 'possessed', and perhaps even what was being
referred to in such as the bible of those 'possessed' by 'daemons'.
'Daemons' were thought to be what dictated our 'destiny', our 'fate'.
Were (are) they really 'negative thought forms'?
>
>
Thanks to all helping explore in this thread.
Jenell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 02:33:59 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
winter mute wrote:
>
>
> But I detect more subtle layers in your
> question. Are you looking for affirmation ?
>
> I wrote a lot the past days and you seem to have
> specifially homed in on my posts in your
> question, therefore:
>
> I can only speak for myself, but
> nothing of what I write about is "deliberate"
> or "technical" in the sense that it has been
> taught or is sought after.
>
Please, no, I am neither seeking personal affirmation, or a postion of
'superiority' related to those experiencing all this differently,
through aparantl a different manner of 'awakening'. I'm trying to
explore, examine, that aspect of it, toward understanding. Not to affirm
myself or any other, and discredit any other.
As to using the terms we've found in books that seem to realte to our
expeiences, we can't do anything else but that, if we are to try to
communicate with one another. we needs words to help us do that. I, too,
have had to seek through various sources what words to use, that tohers
might know what I'm talking about. That is not at all the same as I
might mean when I say something about those that seem to have just read
some books and from that are trying to convince themselves or others
thye thereby 'know' all this. That involves something of what another
thread here has vbeen trying to address, those that don't understand
that 'k' is not a thing we can 'learn', that it isn't in the realm of
things of ordinary 'learning'. The same thing I've heard said about Zen,
it is error to say 'I want to learn Zen', for Zen cannot be taught, it
is a state of awareness, of being. One can learn ABOUT Zen, or k, one
can study toward hw to BECOME Zen, or arouse k, but one cannot 'learn'
Zen, or K, through studying it, learning ABOUT it.
No offense intend at all, Amanda, toward you or anyone else, okay?
In peace and love,
As just another one trying to find the best way to negotiate this white
water river we are all caught up in together, (and yes, sometimes a
little natural irritation at those standing on the banks watching trying
to tell us how we should be doing it)
Jenell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 19:08:43 0000
From: "winter mute" <mumblecatATnospamangelfire.com>
Subject: Really wondering -Sorry !
On Thu, 13 Jan 2000 10:41:14 Jenell wrote:
>Please, no, I am neither seeking personal affirmation, or a postion of
>'superiority' related to those experiencing all this differently,
>through aparantl a different manner of 'awakening'. I'm trying to
>explore, examine, that aspect of it, toward understanding. Not to affirm
>myself or any other, and discredit any other.
Hi Jennell,
:) I can see you really mean what you say now.
I guess I was too quick on the defensive
there, so what I said probably came out
sounding too harsh.
> 'k' is not a thing we can 'learn', that it isn't in the realm of
>things of ordinary 'learning'. The same thing I've heard said about Zen,
>it is error to say 'I want to learn Zen', for Zen cannot be taught, it
>is a state of awareness, of being.
Yes, I agree with you there.
As Zen, I suppose Kundalini cannot be described
by parroting what others have said or done,
and Kundalini experiences are in many ways
the same as experiences with Zen,
trying to describe them are like a
mute trying to describe the taste of honey.
:)
Or that was "shouldn't try to describe",
originally...
>In peace and love,
> As just another one trying to find the best way to negotiate this white
>water river we are all caught up in together,
That is well understood. :)
My apologies if what I said was too harsh
or sounded sourly offensive. :)
Guess I should watch those clay feet of mine.
I'll say as Otto in a the comedy A Fish Called Wanda:
I'm really, really, really sorry !
:)
Best regards,
Amanda.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:14:47 +1100
From: Christopher Wynter <wynterATnospamone.net.au>
Subject: Re: [Amanda] Really wondering -Sorry !
Hello Amanda ...
Who was it that placed that expectation on your behaviour ...
"little children should be seen and not heard"
"oh she is just the quiet type"
(and god help her if she dares to speak out)
Since when does someone have to apologise
for allowing their light to shine
Does a bird need to apologise for singing its song of joy?
Christopher
> >In peace and love,
> > As just another one trying to find the best way to negotiate this white
> >water river we are all caught up in together,
>
>That is well understood. :)
>
>My apologies if what I said was too harsh
>or sounded sourly offensive. :)
>
>Guess I should watch those clay feet of mine.
>
>I'll say as Otto in a the comedy A Fish Called Wanda:
>
>I'm really, really, really sorry !
>:)
>
>Best regards,
>
>Amanda.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 14:16:31 EST
From: SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
> Um.. before I mentioned being ill on this list, a quick survey of
> friends and another list rounded up about a dozen folks or more who've
> suffered.. it's a spiritual flu.. yes, a planetwide epidemic. Misery loves
> company. :)
I wish it could do without me. :(
>
> >and the urge to pop it with no luck for two weeks.
> Pop what?
The joints in my neck. Ew...
> >The heat has been unbearable.
> I'm loving the heat.. the heat is stable and relaxed.. it's the vibe of
> the chills that's had me concerned for my mind.. I'm not noticing pain..
> getting endorphins instead, probably.. but the hypersensitivity and the
> mood swings .. oy.
I've just completely ignored people.."yes, that's nice, but I'm really quite tired and busy" then go and just be. But I could see where if I couldn't get away from people....*whistling innocently and forcing the claws back in*
> I find it is the same. So much that I'm kind of a hermit...
I'm fst becoming one...my hubby came in today with a sticker for me that said "The more people I meet the more I like my dog." That just about sums it up, right there. That 50lbs. of unconditional love... :)
I think
> that to folks who want to grow and open to spirit, Shakti feels yummy..
yes, I can't get them to leave my presence....it's like divine cocaine in a way. People don't understand that it's not *me* they like...and if I pull it all in and just be for a while they grow resentful of me. Ah well.
> those that don't want to grow, it pushes on their resistance uncomfortably
> and they blame/project it at the source ..Brides of Hades, we carry the
> vibration of death. The wise know it is the doorway to the light, to
> rebirth and they draw closer but the fearful turn away cursing the demons.
> Blessings..
Is it really, though? Or does normal life (physically and spiritually speaking) after a journey through Hell seem so good that that's what we think? Same car with a new paint job?
Kimberly
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 14:25:18 EST
From: SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really Wondering -- flu stuff
> Tears come easily, but it wasn't till Kimberly complained about pain
> that I realized I'm not getting any.. if I pinch myself, it doesn't hurt at
> all.. One of my beloveds tuned into me and got massive neck pain that
> brought tears to her eyes.. but I just feel stiff.
I think I got the mental anesthesia...the so called "don't care" shot they give you prior to surgery...I feel enough changing up there that could I actually figure out what's going on I'd be mad...instead I'm fully functional but kinda going "whoa...that is so cool". Just the body's not nearly as willing as the mind/spirit.
It's making me wonder if
> the loss of appetite and nausea might be from pain I'm not feeling... I
> appreciate the merciful anaestesia, wherever it's coming from..
> Blessings..
could very well be...
Kimberly
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 14:29:58 EST
From: SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
> Oh, he was my second husband. Got him over and done with, too. Haven't
> yet quite firgured who I've married this time. We doj't usually ifure
> that out until we got past that glow of the blindness of the delusions
> of love, you know.
I knew when I met him who he was archetypally...my marriage to Thanatos was physical too...
I'm happy, I don't see us ever breaking up...somewhere in there is a deep soul bond I don't think either of s could break in a hundred more incarnations. *shrugs*
Kimberly
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 09:13:14 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering -Sorry !
winter mute wrote:
>
>
> I guess I was too quick on the defensive
> there, so what I said probably came out
> sounding too harsh.
>
>
> My apologies if what I said was too harsh
> or sounded sourly offensive. :)
>
> Guess I should watch those clay feet of mine.
>
> S'all right. We all got 'em. Clay feet, that is. I've often enough done the same myself, out of feelings of defensiveness. I know whwre mine came from, all too often HAVE been attacked in such ways myself, by people that didn't, or didn't even want to try to, understand us. So will assume yours come from exactly the same kind of experiences in your life as mine have. As long as we can keep that in mind (ALL of us!) and do what we just did, stop and check it out, work it out, so that we are 'okay' again, I think we're doing better than average, don't you? as long as we all just keep trying to help each other make it down this river, I think we'll be okay. It's when we try to swim across the current or upstream against it we get ourselves into trouble, start bumping into each other.
Jenell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 09:21:29 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering
SmilingjaguarATnospamaol.com wrote:
>
>
> I'm happy, I don't see us ever breaking up...somewhere in there is a deep soul bond I don't think either of s could break in a hundred more incarnations. *shrugs*
>
> Kimberly
I thought the same thing, for the first 10 or 12 years or so. Then there
were some 'indifferent' years, vague growing sense of dissatisfaction,
unease, some real efforts on my part to try to breathe some life back
into it, which made him pout, and then what the heck, do my own thing,
just live, along with my kids, some kind of life, even if he wanted to
vegetate in a perpeutual pouting mood, then the last 10 years a descent
into pure dee ol' hell.
Jenell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 16:49:41 -0800
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Subject: did everyone get this post of Amanda's?
Sorry to re-post, but I am trying to ascertain if there is still mail
that is not getting thru.. Some folks were not getting Amanda's posts, so I
am asking if anyone did not get this post first time it came out?? Please
let me know directly. blessings.
>To: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
>From: winter mute <mumblecatATnospamangelfire.com>
>Subject: [K-list] Really wondering -Sorry !
>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 11:09:20 -0800
>Reply-To: mumblecatATnospamangelfire.com
>X-Loop: 700002663
>
>
>On Thu, 13 Jan 2000 10:41:14 Jenell wrote:
>
>>Please, no, I am neither seeking personal affirmation, or a postion of
>>'superiority' related to those experiencing all this differently,
>>through aparantl a different manner of 'awakening'. I'm trying to
>>explore, examine, that aspect of it, toward understanding. Not to affirm
>>myself or any other, and discredit any other.
>
>Hi Jennell,
>
>:) I can see you really mean what you say now.
>
>I guess I was too quick on the defensive
>there, so what I said probably came out
>sounding too harsh.
>
>> 'k' is not a thing we can 'learn', that it isn't in the realm of
>>things of ordinary 'learning'. The same thing I've heard said about Zen,
>>it is error to say 'I want to learn Zen', for Zen cannot be taught, it
>>is a state of awareness, of being.
>
>Yes, I agree with you there.
>
>As Zen, I suppose Kundalini cannot be described
>by parroting what others have said or done,
>and Kundalini experiences are in many ways
>the same as experiences with Zen,
>trying to describe them are like a
>mute trying to describe the taste of honey.
>:)
>
>Or that was "shouldn't try to describe",
>originally...
>
>>In peace and love,
>> As just another one trying to find the best way to negotiate this white
>>water river we are all caught up in together,
>
>That is well understood. :)
>
>My apologies if what I said was too harsh
>or sounded sourly offensive. :)
>
>Guess I should watch those clay feet of mine.
>
>I'll say as Otto in a the comedy A Fish Called Wanda:
>
>I'm really, really, really sorry !
>:)
>
>Best regards,
>
>Amanda.
>
>
>
>
>
>Unsubscribe from this list by sending email to:
>kundalini-unsubscribeATnospamtopica.com
>
>_____________________________
>Check out the new and improved Topica site!
>http://www.topica.com/t/13
>
Mystress Angelique Serpent, http://www.domin8rex.com
Vancouver, B.C., Canada. Officially the most beautiful city in the world.
8) :D ;) :0 :) ;P ;) :D |* ;) 8D :)
<<<< I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery
<<<< than live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it.
<<<< -- Harry Emerson Fosdick
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