To: K-list
Recieved: 2000/01/13 06:29
Subject: [K-list] Really wondering .. Ville Vainio, Jenell, Mystress ...
From: Christopher Wynter
On 2000/01/13 06:29, Christopher Wynter posted thus to the K-list:
At 09:42 PM 13/01/00 , you wrote:
>but making yoga exercises during awakened k might
>"drive" the experience to a different direction.
yes
>It seems that some people
>have such a "mild" k that they must meditate to get any experiences.
My suggestion is to practice for the practice..
if there is a purpose to the practice,
then the outcome will be the experience of what you expected ...
and you will be disappointed if it is not
>Sometimes somebody, when asked to describe what k feels like, starts every
>observation/symptom with a reference to meditation.
Meditation is, in its true expression, the art of doing nothing
and being everything ...
Meditation for a purpose (seeking) will provide an outcome
limited by preconceptions (and the limitations of words and language
to the key words stored in the body
>Those in deliberate practises often over-emphasize their distinct
>experiences and develop an attachment to them. That gives the tone to
>their descriptions.
yes
>For me, the spinal phenomena usually happen when having been "blocked" for
>some time, and the spinal "flow" or tingling "dissolves" the feeling of
>being blocked.
and you were the one who was blocking or denying yourself ..
a learned behavioural response to perceived external threat ..
usually to survival or approval ...
> > paranormal phenomenon, psychic expereiences, experienced transformation
> > and enlightment in various ways, and by various means, including
> > 'hearing' voices that instruct and teach, sometimes convey information
> > aparantly from deceased people even, awareness in various ways of
> > 'spiritual entities', spiritual beings, with too much 'verification' of
> > their 'presence' to dismiss as just my imagination or hallucinations,
> > visions and dreams, 'messages through signs', or synchronicities, etc,
>
>Hmm.... I don't think paranormal phenomena are a manifestation of
>enlightenment (that's not probably what you meant, just wanted to clarify
>a bit).
oh yes they are ...
enlightenment is bringing to the light of daily consciousness
all of those things that have been running you ..
down in your subconscious and unconscious
denied .. without your even having been aware of their existance ..
Transpersonal Psychology refers to this area as the
"Transpersonal Bands"
Hinduism refers to the "siddhis"
both suggesting that these are obstacles which should be
passed through as quickly as possible .. and the easiest way
to pass through them is not to make them wrong ....
This is also my experience ... within me were the voices of the lost ..
characters and roles played,
denied, repressed, not heard, not allowed to speak, feared, trusted, ...
both from this lifetime .. and also voices of long dead ancestors
who spoke in languages familiar to my body
but foreign to my mind ....
> > which it seems is not usually a part of the experience of those
> > deliberately practicing to 'raise k'.
yes
>This doesn't seem to be just a
> > difference in my cultural way of percieving it, or the words I would
> > choose to define/describe, but a different kind of experience, period.
perceptions and language of the perceiver .. and the need for recognition
and acceptance behind the description given ...
in other words .. who was the target audience of the description,
and what was the effect sought by the describer ...
please, Jenell, don't put yourself down ... or make your experience wrong ...
maybe you just don't have the (subconscious/unconscious)
>To me it seems that you have a very receptive, "open" nervous system while
>many deliberate practitioners have a more "closed", blocked, static,
>ego-guided nervous system.
yes
>Thus, k can do it's work more freely inside you
>and therefore you feel it differently. Perhaps that's why it awakened
>spontaneously with you in the first place.
or was not as repressed as it is in many others ...
my experience is that in the majority of "seekers", the stronger the
thrust for seeking, the greater the level of denial ..
and the most traumatic the experience ...
I experienced trauma during my initial seeking .. and with the allowing
the pain of the release gave way to periods of tension immediately followed
by a great release ....
> > I'm really wondering if we are really talking about two or even more,
> > quite diferent phenomen?
nope .. but there are many perceptions .. depending on the teacher
or the book you read .. and the filter set of beliefs
that the learning was absorbed through ...
>I think k is such a complex phenomenon
Is freedom complex ... or is freedom foreign to conscious remembering
and thus to be feared ...
>and brain is such a complex device
>that it can do pretty much anything, regardless of how we try to
>compartmentalize it. We really don't know enough about it. Just when it
>starts to feel familiar - boom - something new comes up.
.... or something old comes up to be released which we translate into the
language of our preconceptions .. to make something out of ..
and then we get grabbed by it ..
one of my expressions ..
did you have the thought
or did the thought have you ...
> It's only now that I'm starting to feel the k
>returning to the usual bliss-inducing state.
otherwise known as self induced mesmerism ..
with truly awakened K and full awareness of "all there is"
there are no thoughts, feelings and emotions ...
only the choice of the experience
Christopher Wynter
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