To: K-list
Recieved: 1999/11/01 23:24
Subject: Re: Time (was Re: [K-list] RE: fate, destiny, subtle body and s
From: Ville Vainio
On 1999/11/01 23:24, Ville Vainio posted thus to the K-list:
On Mon, 1 Nov 1999, Martin Thompson wrote:
> >Therefore, everything between beginning and end of time is "known" by a
> >hypothetic omniscient entity (or possibly a person in Samadhi).
>
> Emphasis on the word "hypothetic" I suspect. But the fully
> deterministic, billiard-ball theory of the Universe is well out of date:
> it is fundamentally impossible for any being that needs to observe
> reality to know all about it (Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle).
Yes, for any *being*. Universally it's insignificant whether some
phenomenon can be observed. Determinism is impossible to disprove
physically (we will never know everything about the universe, so there
will always be hidden variables... even when we thought we have plunged
all the way to the core) and determinism is the only rational model.
> > So, the
> >future indeed influences the past (taking that "influence" really means
> >anything), but since there is no free will there is not much to be gained
> >from this. We, as people, are only "sampling" the universe (everything) a
> >moment ("now") at a time, but the everything is still out there.
> >
> >> totality, at worst, a complete illusion as one random but probabilistic
> >> configuration of particles replaces another in no particular sequence
> >> (how that can happen without time, I don't know).
> >
> >This interpretation seems worse because it is simply wrong.
> >
> It is consistent with quantum mechanics. Non-probabilistic determinism
> is not.
Could you elaborate which part of quantum mechanics? I didn't study too
much physics (being a IT major) but what I studied didn't seem to disprove
determinism - it only emphasized how little is really known about that
stuff.
> >Non-determinism sucks.
> I don't know about determinism, but causality as such was severely
> restricted by Einstein, since events can be perceived in any order by a
> suitably moving observer.
Einstein was a determinist ("god doesn't play dice" or whatever he said).
Even the order of events (on time scale) is not really that significant,
since it again concentrates on our limited perception of universe.
Reality is a huge, ultimately static bunch of stuff.
Ville Vainio - vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi http://www.tp.spt.fi/~vvainio
We're all puppets
The first step on the path to understanding is seeing the strings
DISCLAIMER!
Home | Archive Index | Search the archives | Subscribe
K. List FAQ | Kundalini FAQs | Signs and Symptoms | Awakening Experiences | K. list Polls | Member Essays | Meditations | List Topics | Art Gallery | Cybrary | Sitemap | Email the moderators.
symbol.