To: K-list
Recieved: 1999/09/08 16:42
Subject: Re: Re: [K-list] Re: Sexual abstinence
From: Jon-Carl Lewis

On 9/8/1999 at 7:25 PM MHortlingATnospamaol.com wrote:

>The traditional view in India and China . . . has been to advocate absolute celibacy, since it's been assumed
>that enjoying sex would make it impossible for the aspirant to reach the
>highest spiritual pinnacles.

. . . reasons were given, which I liked.

>I honestly believe there might be some truth in all of this, but my personal
>experience has also shown me that it is possible to have an active kundalini
>going all the way to the top at times and to have sex too.

Glad to hear this.

And the following makes sense, too.

>The important thing seems to be not to indulge and not to be so extremely
>focussed on the sexual side of life.

Thanks for the explanation.

I get the sense that we are in a different place now than some of the folks who had to work so hard in earlier times.

I find it rather interesting that much of the asceticism of Islam, the Christian Church, and other sects (Gnosticism, etc.) came at a time when sexuality was so completely unbridled and abused that it bore no resemblance to the head trips and fantasies we come up with now -- and think that we are wicked.

I.e. I don't think so many of the converts to Christian Asceticism were workaholics who took as little time for food and relationships as we do.

Boys and Girls were bought and sold for sexual services at high prices and men were frequently at the brothels.

So, I am reluctant to accept as normative sexuality the ascetic teachings of those prophets living naked in the desert who were spe4aking to people who could literally buy and sell people for sport.

I guess what I am saying is that *any* step in a sexual direction in our society is seen as decadent, when I think the actuality is that we are far, far less sexual, gluttonous and worldly than our pre-ascetic ancestors for whom the world was, literally a trap of vice that could only end in death.

Thoughts, anyone?

Gassho

Jon-Carl

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