To: K-list
Recieved: 1999/05/05 20:12
Subject: Re: [K-list] Seeking input from other seekers
From: nancy
On 1999/05/05 20:12, nancy posted thus to the K-list:
> I am writing to ask for responses, especially from those folks who have
> experienced similar situations.
I fall into this category. Lucky me.
> The problem is that though I have been carefully using the skills I learned
> in my conflict resolution class, of how to be assertive, that is to express
> my thoughts, concerns or feelings in a non-destructive manner (i.e. using
> 'I' messages) he visciously verbally attacks me (as if I attacked him).
My opinion, you obviously were not assertive with this man before. So by being
assertive, you are changing the landscape of your interactions. He doesn't want
it to change and so attacks you to cause you to submit.
> I
> must take care of myself by protecting myself from his abusive anger as it
> is damaging to me emotionally. I have told him that because of this
> problem, we must stick to the regularly scheduled visitations (to avoid my
> being subjected to him).
You don't owe him any explanation. It seems like you are trying to make him
accept your new assertive self. Who cares what he says or does to you?
Talking to my ex on the phone disturbed me so I told him that I wanted to
communicate to him through email only. He thought it was ridiculous. Who cares
what he thought?
What I'm saying is that it may take a while for you to become comfortable with
your new way of being. You don't need to protect yourself against him. You need
to guard against reverting to unproductive ways of being.
> I told him I will willingly go to mediation to
> discuss anything with him. Only in that situation, do I feel safe. What
> started him becoming even more aggressive is when I said 'no' for the first
> time to a request he made for visitation, it is true that I said no because
> he was choosing to visciously verbally attack me during the telephone call.
Why listen to that? Hang up as soon as he starts. He will either learn to
change his ways to interact with you or he won't.
It seems to me that you are in some ways using your new assertive skills to
have power over him. Maybe you're not conscious of this. Seems like payback.
Stop worrying about him and his reaction. Change your focus to you. Again, who
cares about him.
> It is very difficult, because I don't want to prevent his time with the
> children, but working out the arrangements that we both are comfortable
> with (i.e. daughter walking to his house from school for the first time)
> requires that I state what I am comfortable with. Such discussions are
> impossible, unless I just "take it" (his angering upon me and belittling
> me).
As I recall, these details are worked out in the divorce. If he doesn't like
the situation, he has the option to bring you back to court. If he doesn't want
to do that, too damn bad.
Your children have the opportunity to see their dad. No one said he's entitled
to any more. Stop putting yourself in a position where you allow these
conversations to continue.
When I went through my divorce, I had some equipment that I was supposed to
send to auction. I had stored the stuff for more than a year so I figured that
"we" owed "me" the money for that. I decided to keep a few things. My ex was
frothing at the mouth over this. I was breaching our settlement, etc. I told
him if he had a problem with it, he could take me to court. End of discussion.
>
>
> So now, he has said that I am using his children as pawns to get back at
> him.
Who cares what he says?
> And he wants to tell them such things.
I'm sure that in your divorce decree there is a paragraph (like there is in
mine) that one parent is not allowed to say destructive things about the other
in front of the kids. If he continues to do this, you have an option: take him
to court.
> And I narrowly avoided what
> would have been an emotionally distressing scene for my son to witness
> (where his father wanted to take him, though I said no). Such a scene seems
> unspeakable to me. How can I protect myself, yet at the same time not have
> it effect my children, such as limiting their time with him to the regular
> schedule, which benefits me by creating an avoidance of his wrath?
Your kids will be fine seeing him as is decreed by the court. I think that we
parents sometimes think that it's so important for them to be with us. Of
course parents are important, but kids have a way of adjusting and getting on
with their lives. Besides, he can always call the kids.
> My
> decision to stick to the regular visitations is like taking something away
> from them?
Nope. Again, if he has a problem, he can take you to court.
> And now he is so insensed that I said no and he was so angry and
> ready to make a scene at the school where I waiting for my son to finish a
> screening he was having. I was able to drive away with my son while his
> father was busy telling the school counselor that he needed a copy of the
> screening report, etc. . He has never called to ask me for progress reports
> regarding any of the children's growth and development. I would be happy
> to have provided it for him. But he never wants to come to me for info.
Thank God that you don't have to continue to serve him. Let him get his own
progress reports. Let him talk to your children's teachers himself. This is
healthy for him. Stop trying to put yourself in the middle. It is not
productive.
> He
> prefers to yell at me every chance he gets for the lousy job I am doing in
> my part of raising the kids,
Tell him to go fuck himself. Then hang up the phone. (I'm serious.)
> I figure his 50% is to call and make the
> inquiry and my 50% is to happily provide him with all updates. But he NEVER
> inquires.
Stop trying to control what he does or doesn't do. He is the way he is. Accept
it. You've moved on physically, time to move on emotionally.
> It seems his way of functioning with me is to see me as a
> persecutor, of purposely not involving him.
So stop being the persecuted and his words will have no affect.
> In the past I have tried to
> talk with him and help him know it is in my heart to be a team with him.
Stop trying to make him accept you. He doesn't care what's in your heart. He
wants his way.
> He
> would rather make me his adversary, I guess. And I will not go there
> anymore...trying to discuss with him. He is so viscious and I'm not going
> to take it anymore.
You are going there still. You continue to engage; you've just changed the
dynamics of the interactions.
> I feel that since my children depend upon me, I must take care of me, so
> that I can be there for them. And this means avoiding situations of
> emotional abuse. Yet, my saying no, to protect myself (except for
> mediation, which I hope he will do), is also causing his rising up into an
> attack mode...threatening to take me to court and make scenes with the
> children
Let him take you to court. It's your fear of the ramifications that make you a
prisoner. When I could say to my ex, "TAKE ME TO COURT THEN!" the arguments
stopped.
If he makes scenes in front of the children, that's his issue with his
children. You don't need to excuse or justify his behavior.
> I feel so unsafe. I just don't know what will happen next as I begin
> approaching life these days, by exercising my right as a person to say no.
You're living in fear. That's OK. You're moving in the right direction. Now let
go of blaming him for you being a victim. Think of him as a wonderful soul who
has been brought into your life so you will learn how to be a strong,
independent woman. Bless him (the asshole).
It got easier for me once I stopped trying to control the situation and allowed
it to be what it was. When I could see it clearly, I could decide who I wanted
to be in reference to it. No one ever has control over us unless we allow it.
We always have an option. If we can't remove ourselves physically, we can
remove ourselves emotionally. It just takes practice! Hang in there, Connie.
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