1998/06/27 11:45
kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #481
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 481
Today's Topics:
m,resonance.... wondering, and jungl [ "b bah" <happyhunaATnospamhotmail.com> ]
Re: Focus [ Jude1ATnospamwebtv.net ]
Marcella [ Jude1ATnospamwebtv.net ]
RE: paul west [ "jb" <hc19436ATnospamautovia.com> ]
SwaME Paul GoOnAndOnAndOnAndOnda. [ "Chuck O'Connell" <ChuckOConnellATnospamco ]
Re: Loss and Acceptance [ valerie cooper <vcooperATnospamptialaska.n ]
Re: Focus [ "Lobster" <lobsterATnospamdial.pipex.com> ]
Re: Change [ "Lobster" <lobsterATnospamdial.pipex.com> ]
Re: paul west [ "Paul West" <paulATnospamstationone.demon. ]
Re: paul west [ David Bozzi <david.bozziATnospamsnet.net> ]
Re: Loss and Acceptance [ Wonderer <mrtn74aATnospamProdigy.com> ]
Re: Loss and Acceptance [ "jim privacy" <jprivacyATnospamhotmail.com ]
Do chakras exist? [ "Sharon Webb" <shawebbATnospamyhc.edu> ]
Re: Change [ DruoutATnospamaol.com ]
Re: Do chakras exist? [ "Larry Schmitz" <taniaATnospamcentroin.com ]
Re: Do chakras exist? [ Wonderer <mrtn74aATnospamProdigy.com> ]
Re: Do chakras exist? [ David Bozzi <david.bozziATnospamsnet.net> ]
Re: paul west [ "Paul West" <paulATnospamstationone.demon. ]
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 19:57:01 PDT
From: "b bah" <happyhunaATnospamhotmail.com>
To: sassiATnospamworldnet.att.net
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: m,resonance.... wondering, and jungle, Mt, Diablo experiences
Message-ID: <19980627025701.24702.qmailATnospamhotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
hi Jack,
thanks for castaneda info. yes, yes, yes! would like to learn all i
canabout m.r. not sure if i've experienced it or not. I had read a libe
book about TM meditation. experiences started after reading the book.
Upon awakening each morning would see with eyes both open and closed
finely detailed, very intricate, jet black/lemon yellow shimmering
patterns. they were accompanied with warmth on skin on cheeks and skin
over third eye. the patterns
looked like intricate wiring diagrams more than anything else. But they
don't vibrate! The entire surface of my skin was vibrating at the same
frequency. Couldn't figure out if something
was using me as a channel/relay-station, or if i was the transmitter???
WEIRD!!!! Qhhh welll,guess these occurences just get added to the
already lenghty list of unexplained stuff. Sure hope I can get anwsers
after I "die". SOOO many questions, few answers.
I no longer live in Hawaii. Used to though. I worked in the
jungle, 45 min. drive south of Hilo, on the Big Island. I cleared royal
paths and a shrine site, rebuilt walls. Six months after we returned to
Ca. The shrine was placed on the national register of historic sites,
NEAT!
I used to talk to Pele, silently and orally. Never heard any
response. While on Mt.Diablo in the east sf bay area, without any
attempt at communication (this is on an arch. dig) I have beings talking
to me, and discribeing thier life on the mountain. Fasinating.
All because of K! I've rambled too much! 'loha barb
bkac
______________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 22:12:11 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jude1ATnospamwebtv.net
To: PShaw86324ATnospamaol.com, Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Focus
Message-ID: <10527-3594630B-3053ATnospammailtod-121.bryant.webtv.net>
Liz,
Maybe your focusing problems are due to that "Panama Red"...Tee Hee Hee
(giggle)
Judy
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 22:14:38 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jude1ATnospamwebtv.net
To: Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Marcella
Message-ID: <10531-3594639E-1530ATnospammailtod-121.bryant.webtv.net>
How long is she going to haunt this list?
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 04:31:27 +0100
From: "jb" <hc19436ATnospamautovia.com>
To: "K. list" <kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com>,
"Dan Margolis" <dmargolisATnospamabm.com>
Cc: <paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk>
Subject: RE: paul west
Message-ID: <000001bda17c$12457380$4d6335c3ATnospamjb>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Dan wrote:
<snip>
> He seems to have no
> ability to listen to what people are saying to him and to modify his
> behavior based on suggestions from the group. This is one of the
> fundamental requirements to any spiritual progress, [...]
Jan: Someone who is unable to change behavior, lies, exaggerates, in other
words does everything to keep ego alive and karma growing, does have a
problem. The most likely is fear of being completely alone, which is
something that can occur several times on the journey with K. If someone is
very extroverted, this unconscious fear won't be recognized as such and the
behavior would be to avoid the confrontation with aloneness at all cost.
Unsubbing from the list increases this fear immediately so this condition
never lasts long... It means the only help can be in real time but
preferably in real life. As mystress repeatedly wrote, she can't "just"
unsubscribe so the best is to provide some spiritual chat-nets where a
therapy could take place. But apart from therapy, on a chat-net Paul will be
less alone than on a list. It might be useful to draw his attention to this
spiritual chatlist and enlarge it.
Free chat about mysticism:
http://www.theeunderground.net
Join chat at:
http://www.spiritweb.org/
Spiritual chat:
http://www.ascension.net:3335/
http://www.mantra.com.ar/Ingles/chatting.html (click on bla bla..)
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 00:02:25 -0400
From: "Chuck O'Connell" <ChuckOConnellATnospamcompuserve.com>
To: k-list <kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com>
Subject: SwaME Paul GoOnAndOnAndOnAndOnda.
Message-ID: <199806270002_MC2-517F-59FFATnospamcompuserve.com>
Content-Disposition: inline
Dear Klisters,
Paul West needs to grow. Maybe he can't (yet). He should
probably remain on this list in the hope that something he reads will
help him out. He isn't evil - he needs our mercy, but he doesn't
need us to feed his problems by responding, thus keeping him
at the center of his universe.
Here is what I do to prevent him from cluttering my mind
with things that aren't helpful: If he wrote it, I just don't read it.
I read the first few things he wrote. I know how he left me empty.
His words were empty (and voluminous) in terms of what I'm seeking.
Just ignore him. The delete key is a powerful tool, If you read
the digest 'Page Down' is just as powerful.
Dear Lobster: Regarding meditation: Thanks for telling
me "Awareness" - I did know that - I just never distilled
it into that one word. Wow. It is simple. Thanks!
Peace to All,
Chuck.
Bogus Yogis need not reply (You know who you are).
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 20:32:27 -0800
From: valerie cooper <vcooperATnospamptialaska.net>
To: TAvalon <TAvalonATnospamtexas.net>
CC: madammumATnospamptialaska.net, WEIVODAATnospamaol.com, Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Loss and Acceptance
Message-ID: <359475DD.616AATnospamptialaska.net>
TAvalon wrote:
<snip>
> I know this walks a fine line towards blaming the victim. But I really
> don't mean that. In fact, its my opinion that this empowers the victim.
> And maybe, just maybe, it makes the horrifying death just a little more
> acceptable, eventually.
I had a close friend up here, at age 33 (about 4 years ago now), & her
12 year old daughter, die from being hit by a BIG BAYLINER pleasure
boat, on vacation from down South, & hit her & her daughter in a little
skiff.
The daughter was medi-vacced down to Seattle, & both were kept
artificially alive in their brains for about a week.
I've had dreams where I've spoken with Chaya, very vivid dreams, & she
is doing just fine where she is Probably - it is like an 'early
graduation' from this 'vale of tears'.
But, still, in my heart, I cannot yet accept that they are gone like
that.
It could be, that it will remain an unassimilated memory all the days of
my life...
How does one just process this grief & get ON with it? is it just a
matter of *time*? Or, does it transcend time?
************************
Things are more like they are today than they ever have been before.
Valerie Cooper * http://geocities.com/SoHo/7982/
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 09:09:38 +0100
From: "Lobster" <lobsterATnospamdial.pipex.com>
To: <PShaw86324ATnospamaol.com>, <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Focus
Message-ID: <00d601bda1a9$8b4d8420$134e95c1ATnospamdefault>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
>I am having problems focusing on just one thing, one path, one EVERYTHING;
I
>am so indecisive. Any advice?
>
>Liz
Certainly.
As you are indecisive (for a reason) start there. How is your indecision
helping you (it is). What is it trying to protect you from? Where has it
come from? In other words observe your indecisive nature and befriend it.
Send it your Love and ask it what it is there for and how this can be
helped. You see it does not want to be indecisive - it has a reason, an
agenda, you need to talk with it as often as possible. The question is 'why
am I like this?' Accept - do not judge - but find out.
'Why am I like this?'
Be Well
Lobster
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 09:35:51 +0100
From: "Lobster" <lobsterATnospamdial.pipex.com>
To: "Paul West" <paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk>, <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Change
Message-ID: <00d901bda1a9$91c08460$134e95c1ATnospamdefault>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
>Hi.
>
>How do you handle it when you go through a change, on your own,
>unaccompanied by others? I am having problems juggling the emerging
>reality of kundalini with the rest of the world. I am not prepared to
>take sides or play favouritism any more. Stepping off the beaten track
>into my own path is so daunting but so necessary. I just wondered what
>it has been like for others.
Hi Paul,
All change is an internal process. It is much easier if around people who
have undergone similar experiences. The danger is that subjective mind
experiences are often interpreted as 'K'. The situation is that people
interpret their experience. So if one person has a range of experiences that
do not gell with others they are marginalised. Similarly if the person
behaves according to the concensus and aspirations of that group they are
praised and encouraged. So the situation here is not being able to go by
individual experience or group reinforcement.
To find what is genuine, real and integral to ones well being, one must
constantly leave behind the labels of what a situation is, what an
experience or thought is and deal with the experience in that moment as it
is. This is sometimes called 'living in the present'. Here one is natural
and spontaneous and ones innate wisdom comes to the fore.
Be Well
Lobster
Date: 27 Jun 98 14:34:32 +0000
From: "Paul West" <paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: paul west
Message-Id: <359502F8.MD-0.196.paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk>
Dear Jan,
> Jan: Someone who is unable to change behavior, lies, exaggerates, in other
> words does everything to keep ego alive and karma growing, does have a
> problem. The most likely is fear of being completely alone, which is
> something that can occur several times on the journey with K.
I agree. Some people like the feeling of comfort and company that
comes about through going with the flow rather than the peace that is
in not forgetting where you come from.
Watching a world-cup match yesterday I was on the side of those who
had posession of the ball. Regardless. When posession changed I
noticed myself switch sides, going with the flow. So I did an
experiment. Experiments are good, IMO. I stuck to being with one side
only, and no matter when the other side got the ball I looked harder
to make sure I was not convinced by this. A new, strange, unexpected
confidence became of this.
> If someone is
> very extroverted, this unconscious fear won't be recognized as such and the
> behavior would be to avoid the confrontation with aloneness at all cost.
Being alone can be kind of frightening when all one has even been is
psychologically promiscuous.
> Unsubbing from the list increases this fear immediately so this condition
> never lasts long...
:-) This may be true. In my case I let go of the list, decided to move
on. Coming back was an entirely seperate and new decision.
> But apart from therapy, on a chat-net Paul will be
> less alone than on a list. It might be useful to draw his attention to this
> spiritual chatlist and enlarge it.
Funny thing is that I was part of some chat-nets for a while and found
them to be uninteresting. I was at spiritweb on several lists for a
few weeks. It's quite a good place, lots of people, but it seemed too
general and casual. I wanted to get down to business, nitty gritty, to
face things seriously. I somewhat found that on the k list and the
i-am list also.
One can tend to dive in at the deep end to ensure the promptest and
most intense learning, but one has to be careful not to meddle with
the king of the jungle or one might just get bitten. ;-0
--
Paul.
IRC: #amiga, Dalnet: #blitz
WWW: http://www.stationone.demon.co.uk
E-M: paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 10:25:34 -0400
From: David Bozzi <david.bozziATnospamsnet.net>
To: Kundalini <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: paul west
Message-ID: <359500DE.4A39A5E8ATnospammail.snet.net>
Paul West wrote:
> :-) This may be true. In my case I let go of the list, decided to move
> on. Coming back was an entirely seperate and new decision.
Like an addict that struggles to quit?
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 10:38:39 -0700
From: Wonderer <mrtn74aATnospamProdigy.com>
To: Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Loss and Acceptance
Message-ID: <35952E1F.7529ATnospamProdigy.com>
> TAvalon wrote:
> <snip>
> How does one just process this grief & get ON with it? is it just a
> matter of *time*? Or, does it transcend time?
Perhaps, as a reminder of what it is like to be Paul West, last night I
forgot the OFF switch when I went to bed. I'm speaking about my mind, of
course. What a long night. I wrestled with sympathy for Paul and
Kristin, wanting to help in some way with their very separate problems.
I finally shut down, and almost immediately this came to me:
The memory of the face of a widow. Her eyes were clear, but pained;
there were no tears. Her husband had been kidnapped, shot, and kept in a
box in a sweltering shed until he died. She told the press, "It is just
too big for me to take in all at once." People I know thought her cold.
I think she is remarkable, because she managed her pain in small doses,
and held herself together for the sake of her sanity and their family.
Cathy
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 08:56:46 PDT
From: "jim privacy" <jprivacyATnospamhotmail.com>
To: Kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Loss and Acceptance
Message-ID: <19980627155647.23753.qmailATnospamhotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
>From: WEIVODAATnospamaol.com
>Kristin wrote:
Okay . . . Today I lost a friend who I have know since I was five. She
was raped and beaten to death, in her own house. I have been trying to
accept my feelings for all of this, and accept that she is gone, and I
can do nothing but remember all the memories in which we shared. I am
not sure, all I know is that I am falling apart.
>
This has thrown me all off balance; meditation, yoga, mentally, just
everything. I cannot do a thing. I feel almost paralyzed. I tried some
grounding, centering, nothing. My flow of K energy has ceased. I do
though feel a blockage around my heart charka sometimes. I have tried to
clear it, but I am getting nothing from it.
>
I am not sure anymore, just as thought I was reaching the peak, I fall
back down. What a roller coaster, I guess.
>
>Love,
>Kristin
>Pour tous ces petits bonheurs qui ont apporte un peu de chaleur dans
mon vieux couer.
>
>
Dear Kristin:
I cannot imagine the pain you are going through. I lost my mother a few
months ago to cancer, but her death was not sudden or violent. I was
very lucky to have months to prepare myself and to say goodbye. Even so,
it was still a shock to deal with. Her death shattered the (previously)
unchallenged assumption that she would always be there.
I know it's too soon to get analytical, but part of your pain and
disorientation might be because some of your deeply held assumptions and
expectations died along with your friend. Assumptions such as "my dear
friend will always be here to talk to"; "women are safe in their own
homes"; "good people don't get brutally murdered", etc. So you may have
more than one loss to deal with.
Please ignore the sappy platitudes ("just be happy! all is one!") as
well as the suggestions for "spiritual revenge" (what an oxymoron!).
Give yourself a lot of time, be patient with yourself, ask
God/Goddess/spirit to help you heal, then find someone you can talk to
and cry with.
If it feels right, you can check for grief support groups through a
local hospice, hospital, battered women's shelter, rape support group,
therapists, etc. This is a totally new experience for you, don't think
you have to "be strong" or go through this alone. Find someone who *has*
been in your shoes and can help. Someone who can speak from personal,
firsthand experience, not theory, and give you the confidence that you
*will* survive this and you *will* be allright.
If you want to try a book, just about anything by Elizabeth Kubler-Ross
may be helpful. She identified the stages of grief as: Denial; Anger;
Bargaining; Depression; Acceptance. A person doesn't normally go through
all 5 stages in smooth transition, but bounces back and forth for a
while. The "paralysis" you describe is a form of Denial, which is a very
good thing; Denial is a necessary stage because it buys you time to
process this overhwelming information. It's OK to feel blank, numb,
overwhelmed, disoriented. I'm not saying tht you are "denying" reality;
Denial has a very specific meaning in this context.
Write again if it helps, let us know how you are doing; you can Email me
privately if you want. I'll send you healing tonight (it's 7PM Central
Time, June 26 as I'm typing this). You're in my thoughts and prayers.
With Love, -Jim
______________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 12:16:12 -0400
From: "Sharon Webb" <shawebbATnospamyhc.edu>
To: <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Do chakras exist?
Message-ID: <003b01bda1e6$e7ad82a0$c2d11fa8ATnospamsharonwe>
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi,
I came across this Ken Wilbur quote on another list and I would like to hear
your opinions about it.
Thanks,
Sharon
------------------
"And yet, strictly speaking, final liberation, being the timeless
and therefore eternal condition of all worlds and selves, is not
so much the _result_ of the _action_ of untying these knots, but
rather the tacit acknowledgment that these knots do not, and
cannot, obstruct ultimate consciousness. Liberation, in short,
is not the actual untying of these knots, but the silent admission
that they are already untied. Herein lies the key to the paradox
of the chakras: They are ultimately dissolved in the realization
that they need not be dissolved."
"Finally, therefore, the chakras are not real -- in the sense
that they do not pose a barrier to self-realization, nor do they
constitute mandatory stages in an upward climb to liberation. In
the last analysis, there are no stages in eternity -- nor any
ladder _to_ the infinite that does not begin _with_ the infinite.
That the chakras in themselves are not real is the conclusion of
most of the great sages, siddhas, mystics, and masters, such as
Krishnamurti, Sri Ramana Maharshi, Shankara, Bubba Free John,
and virtually all Ch'an and Zen masters. To quote but one, the
illustrious Sri Ramana Maharshi: "Do not waste time meditating on
chakras, nadis, padmas, or mantras of deities, or anything else
of the kind. The six subtle centers (chakras) are merely mental
pictures and are meant for beginners in yoga."
"And yet -- and this is the point to which much of our discussion
must be directed -- the chakras do _appear_ real to the separate
self who constructs these knots in his flight both from death
and from a prior unity with all manifestation....."
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 13:18:14 EDT
From: DruoutATnospamaol.com
To: paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk, kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Change
Message-ID: <a7cc8eac.35952957ATnospamaol.com>
In a message dated 98-06-26 22:51:28 EDT, paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk writes:
<< How do you handle it when you go through a change, on your own,
unaccompanied by others? >>
Dear Paul,
Some of us READ.
Love, Hillary
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 14:42:09 -0300
From: "Larry Schmitz" <taniaATnospamcentroin.com.br>
To: "Sharon Webb" <shawebbATnospamyhc.edu>, <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Do chakras exist?
Message-ID: <01bda1f2$e87ff760$533ae1c8ATnospamlarry>
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0056_01BDA1D9.C332BF60"
Dear Sharon:
You wrote:
Subject: Do chakras exist?
>Hi,
>
>I came across this Ken Wilbur quote on another list and I would like to
hear
>your opinions about it.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Sharon
_result_ of the _action_ of untying these knots, but
>rather the tacit acknowledgment that these knots do not, and
>cannot, obstruct ultimate consciousness......
I cannot say; but, I,in turn, would ask: If chakras do not exist, what is
this continual
piercing sensation I am having at the chakra locations over the past several
weeks?
Larry Schmitz
Attachment Converted: "D:\EUDORA\ATTACH\Lawrence P. Schmitz26.vcf"
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 12:54:05 -0700
From: Wonderer <mrtn74aATnospamProdigy.com>
To: Sharon Webb <shawebbATnospamyhc.edu>
CC: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Do chakras exist?
Message-ID: <35954DDD.6EDBATnospamProdigy.com>
Sharon Webb wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I came across this Ken Wilbur quote on another list and I would like to hear
> your opinions about it.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Sharon
> ------------------
> "And yet, strictly speaking, final liberation, being the timeless
> and therefore eternal condition of all worlds and selves, is not
> so much the _result_ of the _action_ of untying these knots, but
> rather the tacit acknowledgment that these knots do not, and
> cannot, obstruct ultimate consciousness. Liberation, in short,
> is not the actual untying of these knots, but the silent admission
> that they are already untied. Herein lies the key to the paradox
> of the chakras: They are ultimately dissolved in the realization
> that they need not be dissolved."
>
> "Finally, therefore, the chakras are not real -- in the sense
> that they do not pose a barrier to self-realization, nor do they
> constitute mandatory stages in an upward climb to liberation. In
> the last analysis, there are no stages in eternity -- nor any
> ladder _to_ the infinite that does not begin _with_ the infinite.
> That the chakras in themselves are not real is the conclusion of
> most of the great sages, siddhas, mystics, and masters, such as
> Krishnamurti, Sri Ramana Maharshi, Shankara, Bubba Free John,
> and virtually all Ch'an and Zen masters. To quote but one, the
> illustrious Sri Ramana Maharshi: "Do not waste time meditating on
> chakras, nadis, padmas, or mantras of deities, or anything else
> of the kind. The six subtle centers (chakras) are merely mental
> pictures and are meant for beginners in yoga."
>
> "And yet -- and this is the point to which much of our discussion
> must be directed -- the chakras do _appear_ real to the separate
> self who constructs these knots in his flight both from death
> and from a prior unity with all manifestation....."
Sharon,
This is much like a meeting with my boss. We have to sit there while he
painstakingly outlines and fully explores each step in an effort to
resolve a problem. Many times, I know the answer before he begins. But
for him, there is no short cutting the process. This used to be
frustrating, until I realized he HAD to go through these steps, because
that is where he is at. At least he finally gets there.
In other words, every lesson is like a step. Once it is learned, there
is no need to tread this step again to get to the top of the stairs,
for that would be regressing. After one has learned to fly, or later -
teleport - to the top, treading the steps would seem tedious.
Cathy
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 14:42:22 -0400
From: David Bozzi <david.bozziATnospamsnet.net>
To: Kundalini <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Do chakras exist?
Message-ID: <35953D0D.7489C5DBATnospammail.snet.net>
Sharon Webb wrote: (quoting Ken Wilbur)
> "And yet, strictly speaking, final liberation, being the timeless
> and therefore eternal condition of all worlds and selves, is not
> so much the _result_ of the _action_ of untying these knots, but
> rather the tacit acknowledgment that these knots do not, and
> cannot, obstruct ultimate consciousness. Liberation, in short,
> is not the actual untying of these knots, but the silent admission
> that they are already untied. Herein lies the key to the paradox
> of the chakras: They are ultimately dissolved in the realization
> that they need not be dissolved."
We can't solve the problem on the level that the problem appears becauseit is
not real. Dreams are unreal. If you dream you've lost something can you
find what you seek in the dream? Have you lost anything? Nothing, 'cept the
awareness of the Real.
> "Finally, therefore, the chakras are not real -- in the sense
> that they do not pose a barrier to self-realization, nor do they
> constitute mandatory stages in an upward climb to liberation. In
> the last analysis, there are no stages in eternity -- nor any
> ladder _to_ the infinite that does not begin _with_ the infinite.
> That the chakras in themselves are not real is the conclusion of
> most of the great sages, siddhas, mystics, and masters, such as
> Krishnamurti, Sri Ramana Maharshi, Shankara, Bubba Free John,
> and virtually all Ch'an and Zen masters.
Neither the body, the world, the universe and all Her dimensions and mansionsare
real also. But we experience all of this. They are signposts leading us through
the dream to awaken.
> To quote but one, the
> illustrious Sri Ramana Maharshi: "Do not waste time meditating on
> chakras, nadis, padmas, or mantras of deities, or anything else
> of the kind. The six subtle centers (chakras) are merely mental
> pictures and are meant for beginners in yoga."
It's a matter of personal preference. What do you feel drawn toward?What helps
you to remember Peace?
Date: 27 Jun 98 18:01:08 +0000
From: "Paul West" <paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: paul west
Message-Id: <35952B52.MD-0.196.paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk>
> > :-) This may be true. In my case I let go of the list, decided to move
> > on. Coming back was an entirely seperate and new decision.
>
> Like an addict that struggles to quit?
Dear David,
I could leave permanently if I wanted to. It is merely a matter of
common-sense and reorganisation. It is not an issue.
I have in the past experienced the `addiction' you refer to though, in
that you sort of stomp off in a huff only to realise it didn't solve
the problem.
--
Paul.
IRC: #amiga, Dalnet: #blitz
WWW: http://www.stationone.demon.co.uk
E-M: paulATnospamstationone.demon.co.uk
DISCLAIMER!
Home | Archive Index | Search the archives | Subscribe
K. List FAQ | Kundalini FAQs | Signs and Symptoms | Awakening Experiences | K. list Polls | Member Essays | Meditations | List Topics | Art Gallery | Cybrary | Sitemap | Email the moderators.
symbol.