1998/05/22 23:33
kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #396
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 396
Today's Topics: Re: Empathy [ "Orea de Sa' Hana" ]
RE: Any help on gnosticism? [ Mike Stickles ] RE: Scared/Help [ "Jan Barendrecht" ]
Re: Enlightenment (Please don't be s [ "Sandeep Chatterjee" ] Re: Scared/Help [ Imtgxxx ]
Re: solong [ "Sandeep Chatterjee" ] Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 18:49:48 -0400
From: "Orea de Sa' Hana" To: Paul West , kl List
Subject: Re: Empathy Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Hi Paul, You asked, "I wonder if hate has a place in love-to reject
anything that is not virtuous and joyous." First I would like to point out that you can reject something without hatred entering into it, you
could even reject it lovingly.
About seven years ago when I was channeling stuff from God, the most challenging thing he said to me was about learning to love the
unlovable. I am still working on this:
I wish, for a moment, you would try to look through my
eyes at the people around you. Can you scrape away all of the mud, and paint, and rust? Can you look beneath the
obscuring layers of artifice? Young or old, see who's really inside. Someone uncertain, a little shy, perhaps.
Someone who needs to feel liked, who wants to be important, at least to someone... Even if surrounded by
other people, someone who is utterly alone. Someone who needs to be loved.
It isn't hard to visualize such a person, and to care
for him. Or her. But what about the other type of person?
*How do you love the unlovable?*
Loving isn'teasy. Striving for compassion is the first step. The one
who hurts others is hurting, himself. When he strikes out, he does so in pain. He doesn't fully realize what he
is doing, or he would not be doing it. If you keep that in mind, it is possible to feel compassion for that
person's foolishness. Such a person has a lot to learn.
All men are one. Totally beloved. You are one with each other as you are one with me. All of creation is a
part of me, indivisibly. Every iota is precious. When any part of my creation is damaged, the hurt is felt by
me, as well. Therefore, when you hurt someone, or the world you live in, you are hurting your father who loves
you, and ultimately, you are hurting yourself.
Once a person truly understands this idea, he truly understands the deeper significance of the "Golden Rule".
It doesn't just mean, "Do unto others as you would have them do to you," because it is "nice." It is inescapable.
The one who hurts others IS hurting himself.
Oh, I might add that it is not uncommon to dislike someone because they *are* like us and mirror things we do not like in ourselves. As always,
your mileage may vary.
Blessings,
Orea Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 12:19:33 -0400
From: Mike Stickles To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Cc: Ann Morrison Fisher , Stephen Trever
Subject: RE: Any help on gnosticism?
Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BD85DF.EFAB072A"
RE: Any help on gnosticism?
Ann wrote:
<< if other Gnostic gospels are in print, I'd like to know about it. >>
Check the Gnostic Society Library at:
http://www.gnosis.org/library.html
They have on-line versions of many gnostic, mystical, and traditional Christian texts, plus lectures in RealAudio format. They also include many anti-Gnostic writing of the early church fathers (Augustine, Origen, etc). If it has anything to do with Gnosticism, pro or con, they've probably got it on-line.
As far as Gnostic gospels, I specifically noted the Gospel of Truth, the Gospel of Phillip and the Gospel of Thomas (in the Nag Hammadi Collection); the Gospel according to Mary, the Secret Gospel of Mark, Marcion: the Gospel of the Lord, and the Greek version of the Gospel of Thomas (under "Gnostic Scriptures"); and a search of the index using "gospel" turned up gospels of Bartholomew, Psuedo-Matthew, James, Mary of Bethany, Nicodemos, Peter, Thomas (infancy gospel), and the Egyptians. I wasn't looking that hard, so there might be a few more in there.
Stephen, you might want to use their search engine to look up references to "bridal chamber" and see if that brings up any ideas. I also noted an audio cassette lecture by Stephan Hoeller on "The Final Union of Self. The Mystery of the Bridal Chamber." among his lectures on Sacramental Gnosticism. URL for cassette orders:
http://www.webcom.com/gnosis/bccatalog.htm
- Mike
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 02:06:07 +0100
From: "Jan Barendrecht" To: "Kristin"
Cc: Subject: RE: Scared/Help
Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Dear Kristin,
You are undergoing a period where you are conscious of (part of) the burden
everyone is carrying along. Some call it ego. K. will gradually remove this burden, but it takes time. It is not something exclusive to you. Everyone
will experience these periods. A must for you is the book "daughter of fire" by Irina Tweedie. Reading about her agonies will convince you of the fact
you are not alone with this. Without the experience of these periods, there can be no progress. Try to keep your mind busy with doing simple things that
require full attention. Fear is the result of having died many times in the past. You are immortal so there is no reason for fear. Remember, this time,
ego is dying while you are alive. All the other times, it was different. So try to consider it as something positive.
Jan
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 02:06:02 +0100 From: "Jan Barendrecht"
To: "Ann Morrison Fisher" Cc:
Subject: RE: Aura colors Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Dear Ann,
Partly because I had to move a lot, I never kept anything. Not one sketch remained - it is all history. Many were too complicated for me to draw so I
made notes - they landed in the waste basket too. The strangest event was an inner movie (I always checked if the image disappeared with eyes closed). I
was in a space-vessel with instruments and controls that I had never seen before. Even now it would be SF. What struck me most, was that I was in a
state without any thoughts or emotions, although the vessel was out of control and on a collision course with earth. It was definitely not a state
that would require reincarnation, so how could I see it? Because the movie became dimmer, I ended the exercise and didn't see the end. A more down to
earth picture was an external apparition of a woman. I could clearly recognize it as what would have been the "ideal woman" for me (it seems that
everyone of us possesses such a picture of the "ideal partner") before I became hooked to K. The apparition went up in smoke, sharp burning in many
chakras was felt and an awful smell was experienced (the smell of burning hell). Then, great bliss. It seemed to me as if a chapter of the book of
karma had been wiped out. The more abstract pictures are too complex to describe and they were always dynamic. As my skill in drawing is zero, you
will have to do with these two events.
Jan Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 22:24:06 EDT
From: Kristin To: janbarenATnospaminfase.es, kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Scared/Help Message-ID:
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
In a message dated 98-05-22 21:05:51 EDT, you write:
< You are undergoing a period where you are conscious of (part of) the burden
everyone is carrying along. Some call it ego. K. will gradually remove this burden, but it takes time. It is not something exclusive to you. Everyone
will experience these periods. A must for you is the book "daughter of fire" by Irina Tweedie. Reading about her agonies will convince you of the fact
you are not alone with this. Without the experience of these periods, there can be no progress. Try to keep your mind busy with doing simple things that
require full attention. Fear is the result of having died many times in the past. You are immortal so there is no reason for fear. Remember, this time,
ego is dying while you are alive. All the other times, it was different. So try to consider it as something positive.
Jan >>
I feel like I am dying and my ego is alive. I am dying slow and very painful death. I know that most of this is ego vs. k, but I do not think I will ever
make it out. I do not feel like myself, nothing does. I feel lost in my own world lost in my own body, and I do not know how to find my way back. I cannot
survive like this, I have nothing left to do so. I am so scared, I can't do this any longer, I want a way out.
Kristin Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 09:09:47 +0530
From: "Sandeep Chatterjee" To: "GSDonne"
Cc: Subject: Re: Enlightenment (Please don't be sorry!)
Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi GS,
-----Original Message----- From: GSDonne
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com Date: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 07:56 PM
Subject: Re: Enlightenment (Please don't be sorry!)
>At 10:14 AM 5/19/98 +0530, you wrote:
>> >>
>>>>Biharilal: >>>>When you are doubtless about unknown or say when you have no questions
>>>about unknown to be solved,you are in one way enlightened. >>>>
>>"You are in one way enlightened" >>
>>In the state of enlightenment if the "you" remains, then is it enlightenment
>>or delusion? >
>>I wonder >>Sandeep
> > Who really cares?? Centuries ago theologians worried and wasted hours
of >time on
>determining how many angels would fit on the head of a pin. I find >discussions on
>'enlightment' to be similar.
Sandeep:
Agreed.
Maybe future generations will regard it the >same way.
> Sandeep, why is it sooo important for the 'you' to disappear.???
Sandeep:
Not important, just convenient.No space for two to exist at the same time.
>There are many different levels of enlightment.
>Each one building on the next.
Nix. But then let's not perpetuate more angels on the pin head.
>Previous stages/steps may later be seen to be 'an illusion', but are no
less >'real' at the time of the experience.
Sandeep:
Sure.The trick is to "know" when you are in the so called "real" , not
subsequently.
> We learn and grow from our experience of illusions/delusions all the >time thru books and film, etc. You will be waiting a long time for the
>ultimate 'Reality' to then accept that as the ultimate learning experience.
Sandeep; So, not wishing to discuss on the nature of enlightenment (wajtevr it
means), you seem to have well charted your path(smile). Off course we learn.For me all "this" is an opportunity to learn.
The issue is whether I believe I have all ready "learnt", which is what the depository of all your (not you personally GS) ideas and notions or I am
empty enough to receive.
> All this prior talk about 'disolving into the One', makes me feel like
>a jelly crystal. >Personally myself I quite like my Creator given individuality, my own
unique >spark of life. I dont intend to apologise for it, or try to anniliate it in
>some cosmic soup >bowl.
Sandeep:
Good. Whatever works for you. Then why has my words disturbed you? (smile)
Cheers
Sandeep Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 11:48:08 +0800
From: "Anne" To: "Zeljko Dakic"
Cc: Subject: Re: Obsession
Message-Id:
---------- > From: Zeljko Dakic
> To: devatyATnospamic-net.com.au > Subject: Re: Obsession
> Date: Tuesday, 19 May 1998 09:18
sorry for the long post list, but there are different subjects and questions here you may help with...
Zeljko said: can you explain to me what is kundalini opening etc. I know,
at least I think I know, what is kundalini, and obviously you have to start it somehow
:). I heard too many people talking about opening, about dangers etc., but I really don't have idea how it is done.
I'm interested in it because you mentioned that your friend opened through sexual act. I have some experiences which I suspect could be
explained if I could know more about it.
Any info is appreciated.
Anne said: I am still learning and trying to understand the opening of the kundalini
myself, I feel there are people on the list who would be more suited to answering your questions that I would. Their input would help me as well as
yourself.
Zeljko said: The reason for asking you is because I thought that your experiences are recent.
Anne said: My friend and I both had our kundilini open in December of last
year. As for my friend and I we had both been meditating on the chakras for years
and I believe this is one of the reasons the kundalini opens. We didn't intend or focus for the kundalini to start, but I believe it happens when
it is meant to, when the soul or the Goddess decides it is time, when it is needed on a persons path.
Zeljko said: I created for me some of those brain synchronizing
sounds (like brain machines or Monroe tapes). After listening for well, maybe 6 months and exploring it, strangest things started to happen. I was
so frightened that I stopped using it for few years and now slowly starting to experiment again but more carefull.
Anne said: I would love more info on the tapes and your experiences with
them. I find I can reach that altered state instantly now without needing to meditate, but I would like to know more about the process used in brain
synch tapes..
Anne said:> >During her sexual experience, my friend did not have any out of body
> >experiences or the feeling of 'oneness' with her partner. It was a very > >heightened sexual experience with a powerful orgasm and a feeling of
> >'giving' her self completely to her partner. It was after this experience
> >she felt the heat through her body and her chakras, in particular her hands
> >and feet. This was accompanied by a strong love for him in her heart centre
> >and her thoughts and normal thinking overpowered by thoughts of him and > >desiring to be with him. My friend has had the experience of
relationships > >failing, of being in love, but she had never experienced the strength of
> >feelings and thoughts as she did on this occasion. > >Hope this helps
> Zeljko said: Sure it does. One thing is not quite clear to me. Is making
love the only way of opening to kundalini? Well, I probably know the answer :).
Anne said: There are many different ways to open the kundilini.
> Zeljko said: OK, reason for asking was that I have sort of, similar
experiences, but I feel blockade when letting energy flow through my body during orgasm. I thought that if it is some sort of opening, that you
could give me advice on what to do to unblock it. I tried, it seemed logical, to perceive (if it is a right word) my girlfriend as a divine
being sort of :) (its not very hard :) ). I heard somewhere about that.
Anne said: I haven't had this experience of blocked energy during orgasm..maybe someone on the list can help..
> Zeljko said: About your friend, if I may... I noticed that my girlfriend
during our almost 8 years of relationship was going to different fazes of orgasm. Maybe 3 or 4, and every time that 'that thing' happens, she is
clearly overwhelmed and claim that she felt orgasm much stronger than any before and different. Also after effects last longer. I noticed that
because she first felt orgasm with me, so I know how surprised and confused she was after that. So maybe your friend just stepped over some of these
barriers at that point. That also does not mean that she didn't opened her energy. I sort of envy girls because it looks that you have much stronger
orgasms than we are :)). >
Anne said: I think you are right that my friend stepped over a barrier, that coupled with intense love for this man and an experienced lover seemed
added factors. She is still exploring the reasons herself. I believe with Tantric practices both the male and female can experience
stronger/intense orgasms. That blockage you feel may interfere with yours in some way.
luv
Anne >
> >
> Zeljko Dakic a.k.a. DesireCo. > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> EMail: desirecoATnospamsetnet.co.yu > desirecoATnospambeotel.yu
> --------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 00:04:10 EDT
From: Imtgxxx To: KristinATnospamaol.com
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com Subject: Re: Scared/Help
Message-ID:
Kristen writes: < I feel like I am dying and my ego is alive. I am dying slow and very
painful death. I know that most of this is ego vs. k, but I do not think I will ever make it out. I do not feel like myself, nothing does. I feel lost
in my own world lost in my own body, and I do not know how to find my way back. I cannot survive like this, I have nothing left to do so. I am so
scared, I can't do this any longer, I want a way out.
When ego is being chipped away, it literally feels as if you are dying. Somehow, someway, you have invited Love/God into your life, and now everything
that is not of Love/God is being regurgitated up and out of your life. This Love thang is very foreign to your system apparently. Much like when a virus
invades your body, you get ill and feel awful and must throw up at times to feel better. You are bringing up everything that is unloving about you. I
know it doesn't feel so good right now, but if you have the awareness of what is really going on, then it makes it so much easier to cope with. And if you
REALLY think about it, this is a time of rejoicing! Part of your ego is dying! yayyyyy!
You are a magnificent Child of God, made in His image. You ARE Love and you
are learning that this is who you truly are. If you had a friend in the same position as you are in now, what would you say? Would you lift him up, or
bring him down? What words would you say to him that would be loving and kind and beautiful, helping him to transcend these feelings of childish fears?
The words to say are within you. These are the words, the love, to give
yourself now, just as you would a friend. You are learning to Love, and to begin to love, you must first love yourself. You have been emotionally
dependant upon others to give you this love up until now and you know it hasn't been all that you needed. Once you begin working on being your own
emotional support system, then the Universe will know you are serious about loving yourself and will come and support you in every which way it can. If
you cannot begin helping yourself, how can you expect that you would allow anyone else to help you in any way?
You have the strength within You. Your strength is your ego's weakness.
Begin to act strong. When you act *as if* you are, then you will find eventually you are strong. You can easily see that acting as if you are weak
and frightened has gotten you nowhere but where you are now! Your BEST thinking got you there! You are in the drama of life now -- become the star
and write your own script of how you are going to act from now on.
You have been a child your whole life and are now coming into adulthood. It is now time to begin letting that scared little child go and begin being a
grownup. You can do it, I know.... I've seen strength in the past couple of postings you have written. And if you do want to continue being the
frightened and helpless child, then go ahead -- I send you love and blessings. It is your choice, and only yours. There is not one person here that can
change your mind for you.
I will be a part of your strength, your beauty, and your magnificence. I will not be a part of your whining and complaining that are so meaningless to your
life. You are much much greater than that, and someday you, too, will know it.
I love you.
xxxtg
* When a train goes through a tunnel and it gets dark, you don't throw away
your ticket and get off. You sit still and trust the engineer. *
http://members.aol.com/Teeegeee/tgsplace.html To: "Sunil R Peswani"
Cc: Subject: Re: solong
Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
-----Original Message-----
From: Sunil R Peswani To: Edward Gurd
Cc: kundalini-l Date: Thursday, May 21, 1998 03:48 PM
Subject: Re: solong
>
> >On Thu, 21 May 1998, Edward Gurd wrote:
> >> You were quite verbally active in march when I resubscribed and have been
>> nearly >> silent since your realization that what you needed was more
>> prayer/devotion. >> I had been inclined for a while to inquire why you had left and where you
>> had gone. >> Yes, I thought you were gone aleady.
>> you'll be missed. >>
> >> Edward
> Prayer/devotin though helpful was not for me as per Inner Voice. >I am on the right path. Aperson moving towards Moksh passes thro dark
>night of soul once before his last ego dissolves. > On my path of Boddhisattva/adept/master a second night of dark
>soul comes. this experience is different from earlier one.
So "you" are still around to compare experiences.
> Moreover a conviction that Higher Intelligent Energy is totally in
>control and nothing further can be added to this Universe. Everything we >do is a game, so this temporary withdrawl.
So are you saying there is a distinction between this "higher Intelligent
Emnergu" and the "you" that is playing the game?
> I am in search of a list on Buddhism which can help me to either
>break or strengthen this Boddhisattva conviction of mine though
So is this search also part of the game?
even this
>also does not matter.
So then why mention?
It matters to you my friend, you have now "bodhisatva" to be achieved.
Nothing (peswani)
Then who is replying, searching for a Buddhist list, contrstaing and
comparing "dark nights"
Just some food of thought.If nothing of value just hit the del key
Cheers
Sandeep >
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 21:17:05 -0700 From: Mary Ezzell
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com Subject: Re: Strange Emotion For No Reason
Message-Id:
At 01:32 PM 5/22/98 -0500, Ann Morrison Fisher wrote:
>Brent Blalock >
>>Maybe I'll have to do that past life regression therapy stuff to figure it >>out... :P
> >The trouble with that is that a hypnotized person wants to please the
>hypnotist. /snip/ >I think it's fine to do regression therapy for psychological or physical
>health purposes; if it helps, it helps, whether the story that comes out is >literally true or not. But it isn't at all certain whether the stories are
>true.
Right! I'd say give teh yoga groups a good try (even HK's), but not the
therapists. :-)
No offense to therapy -- it's great if people are having relationship problems and want a handle on them, or something. But it's not a way to
find out about a real past life like this!
Not saying the therapists are faking or anything. But as Ann says, what you get out of those sessions is shaped by what teh therapist expects. The only
way a therapist could tell you anything useful here, is if he was also very familiar with India, yoga etc. If he was that familiar -- we'd call him a
'guru' instead. :-)
It sounds like your 'instincts' are trying to break out of the Western mold. (Having emotions that the west doesn't have good names for, etc). A
western therapist won't help with this, he'll just try to put you back in.
Mary
DISCLAIMER!
Home | Archive Index | Search the archives | Subscribe
K. List FAQ | Kundalini FAQs | Signs and Symptoms | Awakening Experiences | K. list Polls | Member Essays | Meditations | List Topics | Art Gallery | Cybrary | Sitemap | Email the moderators.
symbol.