1998/04/27 18:38
kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #339
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 339
Today's Topics: Kurt's example of a good post [ amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us ]
Re: K-list posting Members pay atten [ MsSheWolf ] PROFUSE APOLOGIES [ amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us ]
RE: Nadis and their location [ Kurt Keutzer ] new k forum [ lobster ]
RE: K-list posting Members pay atten [ Mystress Angelique Serpent ] Re: K-list posting Members pay atten [ Jeanne Garner ]
Re: The Guest and the Host [ anandajyoti ] Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 17:00:10 -0600
From: amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Kurt's example of a good post Message-Id:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>KK: How about this? >
>From my earliest experiences the arising of kundalini has often been >accompanied by a tympani-like sound.
>How about that Freda? Brief . experientially oriented ... seeking
>confirmation or feedback from the group ...not dogmatic... raising an idea >... pointers to a couple relevant references ...one classical - one modern.
Yes, a good post. Not much for anyone to object to there.
>``I write what I would like to read.'' Samuel R. Delaney
I have always tried to do this. I always reread my posts before I send
them, often more than once. I usually even find rereading them enjoyable.
Unfortunately, I can't really use Delaney's quote as a guideline, can I? Because I like a bit of chattiness, and silliness, and wit, and you (as
well as a lot of people who hint at this as a parting shot when they unsubscribe) obviously don't.
So there ya go. Maybe someone can come up with another quote?
Here's a few of my favorites:
"The more complex the mind, the greater the need for the simplicity of play." Captain Kirk (probably stolen from someone else)
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Samuel Johnson
"You can believe anything you want. That doesn't mean the universe has to
keep a straight face." Author?
"Ah, arrogance *and* stupidity, how efficient of you!" Londo Molari
And pretty much anything tg puts at the end of her emails!
amckeon (That dang ego just gnawled through it's leash again!)
P.S. If you get this twice, I apologize. Apparently I was unsuscribed! And
it looked as if this had bounced, so I resubscribed and resent it.
P.P.S. This keeps happening over and over so I finally made a new message after I changed the subject line... hope this works
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 17:58:51 EDT From: MsSheWolf
To: serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com, To: To:To:To:To:keutzerATnospameecs.berkeley.edu, CC:CC:CC:CC:CC:kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com (kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com)
Subject: Re: K-list posting Members pay attention!! Message-ID:
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Angelique & Kurt,
I agree that much of the chat on the list makes the list unmanageable and also
doesn't serve the purpose intended for people who are serious about learning more about Kundalini and all that encompasses (some very complicated subjects
requiring indepth study on this topic). Last I talked to you, Kurt, you stated that there are so few who post to the list, and that you and Angelique
had discussed that there are so many lurkers out there who never or rarerly post (my being one of them). This is evidenced, Angelique, by your statement
that "there are over 400 people on the list" (with less than 50 posting regularly - and probably even less than that - Kurt you had a better estimate
of this than I have just given). Just Imagine if all those who are on the list were to post regularly?? It isn't that I don't enjoy the conversations,
and in defense of Lobster...I really enjoy his posts, but the volume is so overwhelming, keeping the posts short would be best (unless it is really
informative about Kundalini and closely related issues, resources, etc, chat should be done off the list, and members remember to snip out the extraneous
information when referencing someone else's post.
Thanks to both of you for reminding everyone to mindful of others and the purpose intended for this list.
Love & Light .... Cher
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 17:03:41 -0600 From: amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com Subject: PROFUSE APOLOGIES
Message-Id:
When I screw up I do it big! Sorry, sorry, sorry to infinity. Note to all:
never allow any form of the word subcribe or unsubscribe in your email subject lines! The automatic thingie will think you mean it!
ARGGGGGHHHHHHHH! Must lurk awhile, must lick wounds, must go away......
bye, amckeon
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 15:19:08 -0700 From: Kurt Keutzer
To: "'Joseph Miller'" Cc: "kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com"
Subject: RE: Nadis and their location Message-ID:
Joe says:
Before talking to him can we at least agree at these points: 1) No matter where Vajra lies, unlike Susumna, Citrini, and Brahma
(S/C/B), Vajra does not cause a permanent rising to a given chakra (i.e. Ajna), that is the energy will fall back to root chakra and not stay at
the chakra, which it can do at the higher chakras if it goes up through S/C/B?
2) Nor does a Vajra rising allow for a chance for enlightenment unless the K. can be redirected to one of those other nadis (before Ajna
when K. has to get on Brahma for the last run no matter how it got to Ajna)?
KK:I think finding a common ground is always the best way to proceed but according to my sources Vajra, chittra and brahma are three constituents of
sushumna. (Rajas, sattva and tamas aspects respectively). So I don't know why it would be singled out in this way. The chakras are constructed in
chittra, so I guess kundalini could go up vajra without piercing the cakras - perhaps this explains a number of experiences that many of us have had -
kundalini rising without piercing the cakras - but I've never thought of things that way. Sorry, don't know how to reconcile our views. Let's both
keep trying. Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:21:06 -0400
From: "Sharon Webb" To:
Subject: Re: K-list posting Members pay attention!! Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi,
Kurt wrote:
>I'm primarily interested in:
>Traditional Kundalini yoga related practices - using effort and intention - >kriya yoga, kundalini yoga, hatha yoga, the yoga of the Nathas, the yoga of
>the Kaulas, Sri Vidya >And those of grace: siddha yoga, sahaja yoga, kundalini mahayoga
And I...sadly...am not. When those posts come in I don't have a clue as to
what the writers are talking about.
Although kundalini yoga is obviously related to k...not all of us can relate to kundalini yoga. Many, if not most of us, have had spontaneous awakenings
and have never followed the yogic path.
So....if I had my druthers, I would rather see esoteric yoga discussions, poetry, and the like on a K-yoga list, and everything else on another...at
least to start. Perhaps later there would be enough interest to spin off yet more groups. I think the k phenomena list was a good idea, but it just
didn't get off the ground.
Sharon Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 23:40:16 -0700
From: lobster To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: new k forum Message-ID:
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------6A9958ADF4953512A62B6CDF"
> Some of us are subscribed because we are genuinely interested in kundalini
> - not because we are looking for a chat room or because we are looking for > a `` spiritual group''. Unfortunately (in my mind) as time has gone on the
> focus of conversation has gone farther and farther away from kundalini. As > a result to many of those WHO ACTUALLY ARE INTERESTED IN KUNDALINI get up
> and leave. Leaving the list to those who are interested in ... well, how > would you characterize it?
As someone not in the least bit interested in kundalini I would characterise it this way:
Most people here have experiences which they wish to explain, share, explore and have vindicated. Nobody (except in imagination) stops this process. I personally feel that not enough lurkers and others post and I would like to hear from them a bit more often. For various reasons this might not be easy but it is worth the effort. Now as someone not in the least interested in Kundalini I try and move people away from what I consider a dramatic but largely irrelevant experience. You are quite welcome to develop peoples interest in Kundalini. You might even consider setting up an email forum on Spirit-Web or elsewhere - this is free - you only need 10 people and everyone can be happy. :-)
So perhaps this solution might serve all. In the meantime . . .
If you feel a snake Kill it
If you find an Angel snap off its wings
but if you meet yourself will you still imagine
that you are not a snake or a wingless Angel
Never Dear Friends Never be your self
You owe it to each Other . . . and your Self
PEACE
(Kundalini unrelated) Lobster as winging serpent
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 15:41:40 -0700 From: Mystress Angelique Serpent
To: "keutzerATnospameecs.berkeley.edu" Cc: "kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com"
Subject: RE: K-list posting Members pay attention!! Message-Id:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 03:07 PM 27/04/98 -0700, Kurt Keutzer wrote: >Such discussions necessarily employ a
>certain amount of technical terminology, often in Sanskrit - but I don't >think anyone is interested in sanskrit-l
My thoughts were rather directed at the many who have complained of the
sanskrit-tech posts.. I enjoy them myself, tho I am not enough of a linguist-scholar to follow them all.
> > It seems that people who are actually practicing traditional
>forms of kundalini yoga are rare here. Any idea why?
Well, that seems obvious to me, Kurt.. The folks who are already following a guru, don't need an email list to find community or guidance.
Some gurus don't even allow their followers to speak of their KA experiences with anyone else. The folks who come here are mostly
spontaneously awakened, often in isolation... When you have accomplished awakening spontaneously, why look for regimens and Gurus after? Goddess is
the Guru and brings all the wisdom that is needed, in moments of Divine synchronicity, even onna radio.
>There are probably 400 or more teachers of 3HO kundalini yoga in the world
but I don't >think we have a single one on the list. Well, 400 out of 4 billion, and only about a million or two of those are
on the net.. that's the odds.. but to be cynical for a moment, it may also be that those who are paid to teach are not so willing to teach for free..
and we don't allow advertising. I wandered into Hotbot on a search of K-sites today, and came up with
over 8ooo. I am on #300+ at this time.. Lots are repeats, mirrors and different pages of the same site.. like Richard's bookshop getting many
separate entries.. and many are cyber temples promoting various gurus.. likely acts of adoration.. However, of what I have found so far, very
little of it seems to be really new or useful information. Seems if you want that, you haveta buy the book or video and hope for the best.. I
expect our website will fill a big hole there..
>I think of it as >being invited to someone's home for a group meditation and discussion of
>spiritual experiences and instead finding a noisy cocktail party in >progress- hardly the environment for discussing deeply personal
>experiences. >
>Kurt All in the perspective.. some folks need a few martinis to shed their
inhibitions enough to get personal.. and I recognize a certain level of chat makes a community.. but at my house we do the meditation first, so if
you have arrived and found a party, you've come late and missed it.. but the playing at the party has more K-fire than the rituals.. hee hee.. no
cocktails tho.. Blessings, Mystress.
> >
> Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:11:49 EDT
From: Harsha1MTM To: shawebbATnospamyhc.edu, kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Re: K-list posting Members pay attention!! Message-ID:
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
In a message dated 4/27/1998, 6:17:39 PM, shawebbATnospamyhc.edu writes:
<So....if I had my druthers, I would rather see esoteric yoga discussions, poetry, and the like on a K-yoga list, and everything else on another...at
least to start. >>
Harsha: I agree with Sharon. Although, perhaps there is a middle ground somewhere in there. Many people do not understand traditional Shakti terms and
certainly do feel lost in discussions of nadis, chakras and so on. People who have the technical knowledge of special vocabulary should feel free to post
on it and discuss their ideas and experiences with others who have similar interests and backgrounds. But there should not be any "pressure" or
"requirement" that everyone has to respond to technical posts in some way or another or join in. I think there is some "genuine" wisdom that flow through
here at times. Let us not limit it by evoking sacred Shakti traditions or preconceived ways of thinking.
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:36:15
From: Jeanne Garner To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: K-list posting Members pay attention!! Message-Id:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 06:21 PM 4/27/98 -0400, Sharon Webb wrote:
>>I'm primarily interested in: >>Traditional Kundalini yoga related practices - using effort and intention -
>>kriya yoga, kundalini yoga, hatha yoga, the yoga of the Nathas, the yoga of >>the Kaulas, Sri Vidya
>>And those of grace: siddha yoga, sahaja yoga, kundalini mahayoga >
>And I...sadly...am not. When those posts come in I don't have a clue as to >what the writers are talking about.
But isn't this a chance to grow and learn new stuff? I don't mind writing
someone, in private email if I'm shy about it, and asking "what's a ____?" I suppose it's better if asked publicly--some of the best, most interesting
posts, have been explanations in reply to someone's questions.
>So....if I had my druthers, I would rather see esoteric yoga discussions, >poetry, and the like on a K-yoga list, and everything else on another...at
>least to start. Perhaps later there would be enough interest to spin off >yet more groups. I think the k phenomena list was a good idea, but it just
>didn't get off the ground.
If I had mine, this one would be pretty much as it is, except less chit-chat, and more "good stuff" like Kurt's post today. I guess I just
don't like to close myself off to possibilities for growth--including kundalini yoga. I've learned more here from simply reading about things
that I'd never heard of, or about which I knew very, very little. When I ask questions, I learn even more. If all I read about is stuff I already
know, where's the growth?
So...with that in mind...Kurt, if you're reading this, would you please explain the yoga of the Nathas?
Jeanne
==-* My stars! Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 17:22:30 -0700
From: anandajyoti To: Harsha1MTM , Afperry ,
Kundalini CC: Kundalini
Subject: Re: The Guest and the Host Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
anandajyoti wrote:
> Thanks Harsha ! for your sending me these inspirational lines from
> Ramana Maharshi's works. >
> I just found out that I have been subscribed fro the K-list by the > System Adminstrator of K-list. This I think, is in response to
> my comments today regarding the volume of K list mail and which are > not pertinent to Kundalini, being the cause of such a volume.
> I do indeed have been fortunate to correspond with your self, Alf > Perry, and Kurt on related subjects.
> It was a pleasure to have known you and the others , courtesy of this > list.
> With my best Wishes, >
> Anandajyoti >
> Harsha1MTM wrote: >
>> I came to feed on Thee, but Thou hast fed on me; now I am peaceful, >> O
>> Arunachala. >> - Marital Garland of Letters, v. 28
>> >> My poem "For the Goddess of Love Supreme: The Call of a Mystic" is
>> in part >> based on these hymns written by Ramana Maharshi. ------------ Harsha
>> >> http://www.telebyte.nl/~frans/kundalini/poetry.html
> >
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 08:44:04 -0700 From: Daniel Rusch-Fischer
To: ks-listATnospamnbn.com CC: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: My ol' Dad.. Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Sa!
******************** Mystress Angelique Serpent wrote:
> > Hello:
> > I have been mostly absent this past week.. Last weekend I was invited
> to attend a native celebration and also got partial crash-course in that > culture.. after I came back I spent a few days wandering in a bit of a
> daze, part of me was still there... as ideas filtered down about the > "problems" I was shown.. like the abysmally high suicide rates among our
> native peoples, and some of the structures and events that led to this > situation of an entire people all suffering from Post Traumatic Stress
> Syndrome. A lot of "Us and Them" victim history stuff there that I am not > accustomed to, having already made my own journeys with the issues of free
> will and the illusion of victimization for myself. >
> Clearing some Ghosties on the weekend, I had been drawn into a lot of > cultural pain and anger, hope and wisdom, and at one point sitting alone
> under the moonlight surrounded by spirits of that place, I found myself > pleading with Goddess for mercy on their behalf.. it pulled me some
> distance from my usual frame of seeking the perfection in everything.. a > reminder for me to not get too caught up in empathy with unhappy ghosts.
> Goddess responded with some strange affirmations of Free will.. showing > me some of the patterns of the decisions the natives as a culture have
> made, in their own struggles for power and territory, with each other and > in the clash of cultures that nearly annihilated theirs.. that shaped their
> path.. very sobering.. and hard to speak of, as ego cannot comprehend the > entire structure and so makes odd guesses based on glimpses of things
> half-seen. Then looks for the polarity to find the balance of > possibilities. A puzzle..
> I do get the feeling that those who were in company with me under the > moonlight got those visions also.. my job was just to show up and be used
> as a communications device. Ground crew. I was getting passing energy > headaches for a few days after, reminders to open my crown wider 'coz
> ghosts were still using it as a light portal. It felt like some part of me > outside of time was still sitting there in the moonlight in conversation..
> > I have since been given the directive to release all attachments.. pretty
> standard advice from spirit.. but as I move to give up what I think I know, > send it out my head back to Goddess, it is replaced by glimpses of a
> wordless shifting pattern of energy.. beautiful greens and purple-golds, > all colors, like an energy map of that part of the planet. It is so
> beautiful I can only give it love. > So I am getting that my work is with the land itself, and not the
> politics of the people on it. Suits me fine.. never liked politics much. > Give love to the Earth itself, it will flow back out magnified to the folks
> moving on it. >
> My host for the weekend gifted me with a drum, as thanks for the work > clearing the ghosts that had been causing his children and family some
> distress. The drum was crafted, he said, by their oldest and best drummer > and drum maker.. and such a gift is the traditional thanks from his people.
> O Joy! > He gave me a choice of two drums.. but there was no contest.
> Earlier that morning, he had gone out for a bit and I wandered into the > kitchen to fix my tea. I had been immediately mesmerized by the drum on the
> table. A simple drum, unpainted and unadorned, slightly scuffed with age.. > but what was it about it that made me long to caress it's skin and hear
> it's tone? > I have never felt that way, about a drum before.. I have not considered
> myself a drummer. I consider myself possessed of a lousy sense of rhythm, > tho I think it has improved over many years of using percussive instruments
> on people.. :) but I have come to appreciate the drumming that has become a > part of the pagan events I attend, and I have felt the vibe and wanted to
> be a part of it's making. > I felt that the drum was sacred, I wondered why it was sitting there on
> the table, but as guest, I dared not touch. I had been given some books on > native culture to occupy myself with, tho the drum seemed to be distracting
> me from my reading.. I looked up often to gaze at it's tawny skin, and > after a while the women of the house came in to play with a small gaggle of
> children. There was a little blonde girl of about 3, who struck me as a > very independent child.. little Domina in the making. She wanted to play
> the drum, and one of the women held it for her while she struck three > perfect beats with the stick and then gazed at me with clear blue eyes as
> if to say, "see, the drum teaches you, it is easy..it likes white girls > too.." and I sat astonished at the perfect tone I had heard.. captured.
> When my host offered it as a gift to me I was speechless.. astonished. > Awed. Grateful.
> Later that day, I held it in my arms and felt it as sentient to the point > of being aware of itself.. it made my K-fire roar, and I invited my host to
> feel the heat pouring out of the "attachment point" at the base of the back > of my neck.
> I sat with it for a few days before I tried to play it. Getting to know > it a bit, feeling shy, feeling that the first playing would be amazing..
> and it was, but for a different reason that I had guessed. An old friend > who has not been around lately showed up, delighted that at last I had a
> drum in my lap.. My slave beyond death, cymbal. I had asked to buy his > drum off his parents after he passed on, but it was no surprise that they
> were not ready to give it up. > I laughed out loud at the sheer perfection for several minutes as he
> reminded me that he was an orchestral percussionist and a music teacher,.. > (the first of many things he had lost to depression.. before I met him.)
> and offered me a drum lesson. cymbal took over my fingers to tap out > complex, shifting rhythms.. very beautiful. Joyous, the unity.
> > I decided on Tuesday to go visit the old folks while they were
> vacationing at their timeshare.. brought slave #1, druid along to meet them > and showed the drum to my Dad.. he converted to Roman Catholic when he
> married Mom, but he held the drum and confessed of great reverence and > respect for Native spirituality, and started talking about how he always
> had apologized to animals before he killed them, as a farmer must kill > sometimes... and of other things.
> The circle comes round.. natives and colonists.. My English Grandfather > got an OBE in the Boer War and a chunk of Canada as a bonus. X-mas is
> pagan.. who colonized who? >
> That was surprise #1.. surprise #2 was that both of my folks were open to > getting some therapeutic touch from me, and a crystal layout.. My my, that
> was indeed a wonder.. I tried to guide them thru the grounding exercise, > each of them separately as the crystals did their magic, but they were
> pretty resistant, interrupting to ask questions about unrelated things.. > I did the layout on my Dad second, and surrendered to his interruptions
> and questions with patience, telling him about the chakra rainbow within.. > I had Barbara Brennan's "Hands of Light" with me, and he had gotten very
> interested in looking at the drawings of auras and energy work.. I > mentioned to him the "flower of Joy" chakra and how it sometimes emitted an
> unidentifiable odor.. > He interrupted me with intensity this time to tell me he sometimes gets a
> smell, that comes with a feeling that he does not like at all, and with it > come intense vibrations that make his whole body shake, and his head ache..
> a few more questions revealed more details of several old healed wounds > had been mysteriously acting up again, and his digestion had been doing odd
> things, odd food sensitivities, ringing in ears.. ever since X-mas. His > doctors are confused.. yes we have heard this story before, eh? LOL! I
> shake my head in wonder. > So surprise #3 was the biggest.. My dear old Dad is KA.. Life continues
> to be amazing. > I gave him some guidance for handling the flares, and a lot of
> reassurance that it is normal for what he is experiencing.. promised to > send him a "Kundalini care package", info I'll print and send from my
> favorite sites on the net.. some books.. and even some of my own writing.. > So now I am informally my Dad's kundalini guru.. not that I expect he'll
> accept much advise.. but I am open to more surprises. Blessed be. > Love, Mystress.
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 17:09:09 +0000 From: valerie cooper
To: fredaATnospamblarg.net CC: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: weeping Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
freda wrote:
> If anyone out there has experienced this, please write and give me your
> input... dear freda (et al),
yes, yes i do sometimes too. just a few days ago i was thinking about this murder trial from this guy who ambushed another guy out on another
island, & was struck with uncontrollable weeping at work, so i hunched down on the floor & did some yoga stretches.
it was not really the pity for the man that caused it, but i think the ensueing realization of relative helplessness.
we can work on ourselves but are powerless to change others. when others are out of control, or even out of sync, what can be
done? it is my experience that hormonal levels are responsible for
unidentified weeping as well. even if people just watch me on these lists, they'll notice i become extremely emotional over little to
nothing about the time of the full moon, to which my cycles are set. being aware of hormones is a depth perception that is difficult to
maintain vigilantly! v
-- for what it's worth;
valerie cooper http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/7982/index.html
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:32:38 EDT From: Harsha1MTM
To: anandajyotiATnospamgeocities.com, AfperryATnospamaol.com, kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com Subject: Re: The Guest and the Host
Message-ID:
In a message dated 4/27/1998 5:18:51 PM Pacific Daylight Time, anandajyotiATnospamgeocities.com writes:
< I just found out that I have been subscribed fro the K-list by the
> System Adminstrator of K-list. This I think, is in response to > my comments today regarding the volume of K list mail and which are
> not pertinent to Kundalini, being the cause of such a volume. > I do indeed have been fortunate to correspond with your self, Alf
> Perry, and Kurt on related subjects. > It was a pleasure to have known you and the others , courtesy of this
> list. > With my best Wishes,
> > Anandajyoti >>
Harsha: I do not understand your message Anandajyoti. There must be an error.
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