1998/03/24 11:24
kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #226
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 226
Today's Topics: Re: gurus redux [ "Jan Barendrecht" ]
Re: Kundalini Research (was Personal [ Anurag Goel ] Re: gurus redux [ Harsh Luthar ]
Re: Greetings from a Newbie [ "Orea de Sa' Hana" ] Re: street lights and K? [ MMeyers541 ]
Re: Abhyasa Yoga-Pranayama [ Harsh Luthar ] Re: AutoPost from Kundalini Resource [ MMeyers541 ]
Re: Abhyasa Yoga [ MMeyers541 ] Re: Brainstorming [ MMeyers541 ]
bothered [ "Debora A. Orf" ] Re: shamanism [ "Orea de Sa' Hana" ]
Re: street lights and K? [ "Orea de Sa' Hana" ] Re: PRANAYAMA [ Gloria Greco
To: Subject: Re: gurus redux
Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0031_01BD573B.228A0700"
From: Harsh Luthar
Date: Monday, March 23, 1998 11:55 PM
>
> >Jan Barendrecht wrote:
>But without the Bodhisatva vow, one will never become a Buddha. >
>> Jan >
>The Compassionate Harsha smiles: As long as one is attached to any vows one will
>never become a Buddha. (Please don't beat me!:-). >
>
Hmmmm.... Attached to vows? The vow is made with the same detachment that a Satguru shows in his commitment to a disciple, isn´t it?
Rather detached by reflecting on the expression "nothing can ever satisfy me",
Jan
Attachment Converted: "C:\SLIP\EUDORA\kunda176" Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 21:42:13 +0530 (IST)
From: Anurag Goel To: Jan Barendrecht
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com Subject: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #222
Message-Id:
Hi,
I want to say something here. I think that masters/gurus reincarnate all the time.But i don't think it's just for the sake of disciples.
I think life is not only on earth but else where too and MASTERS/GURUS
must be having disciples there also.
Love, anurag
> like helping others and taking rebirth? A logical conclusion would be that a
> fully enlightened one taking rebirth will be a fully enlightened one > immediately, because a fully enlightened one has exhausted all karmas and
> hence takes rebirth without karma. If it would be so uncomplicated, no doubt > in every system of meditation all masters/gurus would be reincarnating all
> the time just for the benefit of disciples :-))) They don't - so there must > be a vast difference between "fully enlightened ones" of Buddhism and all
> others systems of meditation. What has always amazed me is that only > Buddhism offers this variety of full enlightenments - to me it defies logic
> whereas Buddhism is said to be open to logic. >
> Jan >
> >
> >
> >
> Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:29:43 -0400
From: "Orea de Sa' Hana" To: kl List
Subject: Re: Brainstorming Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I have had no electrical occurrences, but a former neighbor of mine (not
spiritually inclined) could only wear Seiko watches for this reason.
-Orea Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 21:57:19 +0530 (IST)
From: Anurag Goel To: Joseph Miller
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com Subject: Re: Kundalini Research (was Personal Genius)
Message-Id:
Hi joe,
Can you provide me the more info about research in kundalini . I am also interested in it.
Love,
anurag Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:35:54 EST
From: MMeyers541 To: annfisherATnospamstic.net
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com Subject: Re: street lights and K?
Message-ID:
In a message dated 98-03-24 05:37:53 EST, you write:
< I've heard of a number of women who find, when they separate from their husbands, suddenly all the machines in the house go out of whack. It
happened to me - I was continually calling a repairman. And I didn't have overt K. then, nor did the other women. Maybe temporary manifestations?
Maybe no grounding when the men leave? >>
Hi Ann,
Just went thru a similar experience--which, as an astrologer, I would normally attribute to Mercury Rx, but the next one doesn't start until, I believe,
Friday. Here's what happened: Nite before bus. trip to Miami ATnospam 11 PM after working 18
hrs. in prep for trip, mouse goes out on computer--not able to use 2 days' worth of work on trip bec. have to leave at 4:30 AM; can't replace mouse.
Flight canceled due to mech'l bkdown. In Miami, laptop computer won't work. Once up & running, email doesn't work. Go into client's office--their system
crashes. Try to use hotel fax/email/computer: out of order. 2 ATM machines don't work. Office sends me Fed Ex--never receive. Office sends me
fax--hotel delivers to wrong room. Hotel has false fire alarm at 4:30 AM. I go into client's on Sunday, work OT to catch up: next day, go to email work
to Denver--work missing on laptop. Try to make urgent phone call--FOUR PAY PHONES IN A ROW DON'T WORK. Go to L.A. At airport, try to call cousin:
THREE PAY PHONES DON'T WORK!!! At cousin's, flush toilet: Pipe breaks loose: bathroom & bedrom flood. ATnospamATnospamXX$$%%&???!!!!!!
What are your thoughts on all THIS??? (Besides the Universe telling me I'm
probably in the wrong job??) Thx for listening--Michele
P.S. In a sense, similar to your sep. w/husband--I had already "separated" from my job as a tech writer--have been discussing writing assignmts w/ eds.
of astrology publications, etc. Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:37:12 -0500
From: Harsh Luthar To: Jan Barendrecht
CC: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com Subject: Re: gurus redux
Message-ID:
Jan Barendrecht wrote:
> Jan: Hmmmm.... Attached to vows? The vow is made with the same > detachment .....
> > Harsha: If there is already detachment, then there is nothing to
> propel one to take a vow. For example, let us say I am indifferent to > Chocolate. Would I now stand in front of my favorite Deity and say "I
> swear by God, I shall eat Chocolate no more!" Do you see the logic? >
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:43:12 -0400 From: "Orea de Sa' Hana"
To: djebelATnospamcamalott.com, kl List Subject: Re: Greetings from a Newbie
Message-ID:
Welcome Cynthia!
You are not the only pagan on this list. I am a witch of sorts, though not as heavily into ritual as many. It is indeed a beautiful religion.
For the record, I don't think identifying K activity is nearly as easy as
telling when you are in love!
Glad to have you here.
Blessings,
Orea Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:55:17 EST
From: MMeyers541 To: richardATnospamskydancer.com
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com Subject: Re: street lights and K?
Message-ID:
In a message dated 98-03-24 08:03:59 EST, you (or the person responding to your email--??) write:
< I don't know, maybe, but would you really want scientists to give you
>labels even there? ;)))
>>Michele: Labels aren't always such a bad thing. For ex: Last year, went into a 7-11 w/an empty cup to get a refill discount on my Super Big Gulp. Got
the refill. After leaving the store, see that someone's following me out--it's the clerk.
"Next time you might pay for your drink," she says. Space cadet me: "Omigosh! I am SO sorry!" Point to dollar that is IN my hands. "See, I was
going to pay!"
Follow clerk back into store. Inside are two POLICEMAN, laughing. I point to money again. "I am SO sorry." Plead insanity (the "label"). Police laugh
again. "Get outta here," they say, waving me off (& refusing to take my money). So, mentally ill Michele gets a free Big Gulp after trying to "steal"
it under the nose of 2 cops.
The End (of the Big Gulp Caper) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:58:37 -0500
From: Harsh Luthar To: Afperry
CC: Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com, Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com Subject: Re: Abhyasa Yoga-Pranayama
Message-ID:
Afperry wrote:
> I should be most interested in your and other list members' views on this > point as I see it as crucial to how we should advise others i.e. the dangers
> of premature arousal. Would not our energies be better spent in straight > meditation, devotion, service, etc. rather than esoteric techniques which may
> prove to be damaging mistakes? This is not to deny the value of such > techniques for many people but I am questioning their open and unprepared
> application, especially for beginners on the yogic path. >
> With blessings, > Alan
>
Harsha: Alan I am in general agreement with what you said in your complete post.
Some people, however, have an innate tendency towards certain spiritual practices. They are compelled, as if it were, to engage in "esoteric" pranayama and yogic
practices because these practices are "normal" for them and help them on the spiritual path.. Unless there is a strong interest coming from within, no one can
sustain these spiritual practices for prolonged time periods. Generally for most people, the body's inner wisdom tells them if they are going too far in their
exercises and need to slow down. But people do make mistakes sometimes which is why it is good to have some guidance.
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:05:22 EST From: MMeyers541
To: lobsterATnospamclara.net Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: AutoPost from Kundalini Resource Center Message-ID:
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
In a message dated 98-03-24 10:01:00 EST, you write:
< Once again my sincere apologies for all I have put you through.
Lobster >>
Lobster Man, I'm cracking up big time--& it's ALL YOUR fault! Michele Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:10:54 EST
From: MMeyers541 To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Abhyasa Yoga Message-ID:
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
In a message dated 98-03-24 03:44:44 EST, I wrote to Hillary:
< not hearing an invoice, >>
RE: "invoice"
You see, I used to "pay" for not listening to my guides/guardian angels! Now
I always listen to my invoices!!
--Michele P.S. As you'll see from another email to the k-list, I don't pay for my Big
Gulps either! Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:25:54 EST
From: MMeyers541 To: oreaATnospamerols.com
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com Subject: Re: Brainstorming
Message-ID:
In a message dated 98-03-24 11:25:30 EST, you write:
< I have had no electrical occurrences, but a former neighbor of mine (not spiritually inclined) could only wear Seiko watches for this reason.
-Orea
>>
Hi Orea, what's different about Seiko watches? (Am asking because I have NEVER been able to wear a watch, either; not that it matters, since everything
happens at the right time anyway.)
E = MC squared, Michele
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:29:47 -0600 (CST) From: "Debora A. Orf"
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com Subject: bothered
Message-ID:
the international campiegn for tibet sends me email all the time. This
time its about 6 people who are trying to get the UN's attention on the issue of Tibet.
this is bothering me, and i guess it should, 6 people willing to die by
starving themselves for their people. Who wouldnt feel for them.
partly i feel ashamed, how long will countries like China be allowed to do the things they do to their own people?
its hard when reading the newstories, you can see the tent walls.
part of us is dying because another part of us is cruel.
how long until we realize all beings are only our sisters and brothers
mothers and fathers and friends.
--janpa Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:57:39 -0500
From: Fernando Velez-Pardo To: kundalini
Subject: I would like to STOP receiving messages!! Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Your e-mail list is wonderful and I would love to continue receiving
information However when one arrives to work and finds 254 or more messages it is too much. I have a lot of work right now and I am
traveling a lot, in consequence not to much time to dedicate to this specific reading, specially when I can not dedicate the needed time to
give or receive support. I would like to thank all those that gave me a warm and insightful welcome a couple of weeks ago! I will always cherish
them. I have always kept in mind do one thing at a time and do it well. I'll keep with my K. studies and exercises, see you in the near future!
Love and blessings to all,
Fernando
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 23:05:52 +0530 (IST) From: Anurag Goel
To: Jan Barendrecht Cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Unresolved side-effect Message-Id:
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hi jan, I remember that I have read somewhere that once a rishi
burnt the person alive to ashes with the rays that came from there eyes. May be something regarding this can be found in
scriptures. Also the Lord Shiva burnt Kamadeva to ashes from the rays which emmanted from his third eye.
love, anurag
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:54:23 -0500 From: Antoine
To: "Debora A. Orf" CC: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: bothered Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Debora A. Orf wrote:
> how long until we realize all beings are only our sisters and brothers
> mothers and fathers and friends.
I don't know Janpa... but i believe, with you and those Tibetans, that we will all come to realize it one day.
Antoine
-- "A new world is born in every moment. The question is, are we present to this
magnificent birth?" Marcus S. Robins Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:50:15 -0400
From: "Orea de Sa' Hana" To: Lia , kl List
Subject: Re: shamanism Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Lia wrote:
>
> In many shamanic traditions, the shaman travels to other planes or > 'worlds'. However, they are usually the Lower world, the Midworld and
> the Upper world. These are not related to chakras, or whether one > becomes heart centred - but merely part of the 'job' to do. Certain
> tasks tend to be done on certain level. >
> $0.02 from a list newbie
You reminded me, Lia, of an interesting shamanic journey I had. I decided to
try journeying to a tape of the Gyuto Tantric Choir instead of my usual drumming or didjeridu. Instead of the "ususal" Lower, Middle or Upper World,
I found myself in a high, arched area that felt like a cathedral, except I realized it was the spine. In the course of the journey, energy rose from the
base of my spine up to the crown. I wanted it to stay there, it felt great, but it insistently pulled itself back down to the base then turned and shot
up, out the top of my head and sprinkled silver light all around me in a three or four foot radius.I knew very little about chakras at the time, so I found
the whole thing very surprising! LOL ;-)
One idea that has stuck with me since then, is what a great world this would be if we all went around, blessing the people around us with a shower of that
wonderful energy as we went about our daily lives.
The other cool thing was that, although the it is a quite repetitive chant, I *knew* when it was about to end.
Blessings,
Orea
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:54:11 -0400 From: "Orea de Sa' Hana"
To: John Living , kl List Subject: Re: street lights and K?
Message-ID:
Heck, and I was just thinking how useful it would be if you lost the remote for your TV!
Orea
John Living wrote:
> > Hi
> > Seeing the power of K-listers to turn electrics on/off, I wonder
> - Can this be turned into a useful skill ? >
> For example, it could save limbs and lives if used to detonate mines, or to > make mine detonating systems inactive (& safe), or even to change the nature
> of the matter in the explosives / detonators. >
> Any volunteers ? >
> Any other positive uses ? >
> John >
> J.M.Living, P.Eng., A wise old owl lived in an oak; > 2731 West 11th.Avenue, the more he saw, the less he spoke;
> Vancouver, B.C., the less he spoke, the more he heard; > Canada V6K 2L8 he was definitely not a political bird !
> Vox & Fax (604) 737-7456 >
> "The Truth is out there !" - and YOU can find it by Dowsing ! > Dowsers * Questers / Canada: "http://users.uniserve.com/~questers/"
> Learn to use a Pendulum: "http://mypage.direct.ca/j/jliving/penlearn.htm" Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 10:16:35 +0100
From: Gloria Greco To: pam roberson , kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com,
gkiefferATnospamnetaxis.com Subject: Re: PRANAYAMA
Message-ID:
Gloria Greco wrote:Note to list members, I put Gene on this conversation so if you don't want to read the whole thing just delete now. I left it
on so that he could participate. >
> pam roberson wrote: > >
> > ---Gloria Greco wrote: > > >
> > < > > worked with people who have been in the mental hospital and it is > > spirit
> > > imbalance rather then simple mental or psychois, and someone who is in > > > balance comes into the picture,>>>
> > Pam: > > I agree with you so completely. And I do hope for some enlightened,
> > balanced souls to start getting envolved in helping those tortured > > souls who are confined, drugged and brainwashed into thinking they are
> > insane. >
> GG > It is an area that life could change drastically if mental health people
> were trained in understanding kundalini and the state of toxic mind > which creates the illness of the mind. When K energy goes into the
> unclean mind, it does create terrible thoughts, images, visions, voices, > etc. It is a matter of bringing order and letting go, if one is not
> trained in detachment and understanding the nature of the mind it is > very difficult. This is one area that human kind could be greatly helped
> by just learning this one thing. And Gene is right minds have to open to > what is not known, in order to understand this. As long as the mind says
> things only exist that can be seen once they cut people open at death, > then they can't perceive the invisible, which kundalini is. If the mind
> can understand that the invisible creates the visible then all of this > opens a window of awareness that greatly shifts the ability to know and
> learn. This perception is very different however, and people have to be > willing to step out on that limb. It is not easy for them, doctors in the established reality, even for
> those who begin to know and understand since it is very difficult to > prove.
> > > Pam (I'm leaving this on so that Gene can come into the conversation if he wishes)
> Gloria: > > <
> > enlightened folks will get into the system to retreive those who are > > > simply lost in their own creation.>>>
> > Pam > > Your understanding of this horrible situation is wonderful. It truely
> > is a horrible place to be. I had mentioned in another post that I was > > hospitalized in an institution for observation. After being released
> > (4 days later), I made an effort to get a job there. I did, and what I > > saw and experienced still makes me cringe. There were numerous
> > physical assaults made by the employees on the patients. Patients were > > being overly drugged and/or sedated because the employees of the
> > hospital didn't want to be bothered by them. And the list goes on. > >
> > While working there, I knew there was something much deeper going on > > with the patients besides mental illness. Years later I became
> > completely convinced of the fact that most of those patients were > > experiencing a spiritual awakening or a spiritual connection of some
> > kind that they just didn't understand. Or perhaps in the beginning > > they had a clue, but once they told others about the "voices," then
> > they were locked away and drugged into a perpetual state of confusion > > or constantly told that what they were experiencing wasn't real.
Gg
They even have a name for it, Jesus Christ something or other??? >
> GG > Yogi Tom can tell you about this, and I do believe many people have
> experienced losing their power by being put into the mental health > system when it can in no way understand the spiritual process underway.
> The thing is that you have to have the inner understanding to know that > you can't tell people just anyone about these experiences, that is the
> first thing. And then you have to be very strong inside and very aware > so that you are not afraid or tending to go into the voices and thoughts
> as being real.( at least on this plane it is not real, but on the plane > where these folks are opened to at the time, it is very real, and since
> the doctor is not in an altered state, he/she can't experience it as > real, can they?)
> > This also takes consciousness. Once you are sucked into the system, you
> are forced into their/doctors/mental hospitatl belief system ...which > involves mental thoughts as knowledge of what is real and isn't. (By the
> way their reality is only right at this level of perception because when > you move into the next it is absolutely flawed).
> > So it is a difficult line to walk without someone who deals with it in
> experience and knowing at their side, this knowing also only comes from > grace and previous lifetimes of living in higher consciousness. Now,
> all it took for me was to explain it and then to tell my friend that I have > seen and experienced this kind of thing but I do it from direct
> perception of the invisible world, so that when I saw and could > understand what they are as spiritual beings, or thought forms, or
> whatever energy system they were created from, you break the illusion > by simply going into it and not pulling away from it. As soon as you
> pull away and want it to go away in this way you actually give away your > power. The power is held inside through direct awareness from the High
> Self even if the person doesn't yet know they have a High Self. In > spirit they know this and so you explain that the High Self is aleady
> protecting them and that to turn to this awareness, in consciousness is > why it is happening. In spite of it being very hard to understand, it is a teaching from spirit that is coming through. And is very good.
> But, here... > it is indeed illusion, which is what they are telling you... the
> doctors, but it isn't illusion for the reason they are telling it to > you. They are telling you that your mind is sick and what you experience
> is false, and for them this is what they see and experience and so they > believe they are absolutely right. If they were in the spirit world
> dealing with this as many of the people in the hospital are, part here and part there... it is > every bit as real as this world is to the senses that work on this
> plane. >
> The problem manifests when people are part here and part there, you > can't live part here and part there. You have to be all here, and
> understand there, or all there and be able to deal with consciousness by > also moving to this state. When you come into this state you have to
> have all of your senses in tack to again register and understand that > your in the third dimension block and not partially in the fourth. Now
> in the fifth it is all cleared up again, but while your in the fourth > this is the problem. The fourth is the astral where all of this occurs.
> > The truth is the desk I'm writing on is an illusion as well, it is
> energy not a solid peace of furniture, but in this reality(third > dimension) it appears as a desk. This is no different, if we were to
> tell them it is illusion again they would say we are crazy. But it is > perception that is different. Good and Evil as such fall into these
> categories, it is only true at one level of perception, as soon as you > move into higher realities all of this disappears.
> > Beyond time and space none of this exists as such.
> >
> Gloria from previous conversation: >
> > > < > > flock to me like a magnet. And pretty much you can feel the energy go > > > out of you as this huge need is present,>>>
> Pam: > > > Yes I experienced that too. I just wish that I knew then what I know
> > now. Because it did suck the life out of me and I left that job > > (reluctantly) after a year. I suppose there was a reason for me not to
> > understand completely then. Perhaps what was needed of me then was > > just to treat the patients like the human beings that they are. I used
> > to take them out to eat and shopping and to the movies. The joy we > > shared on these outings is just immeasurable.
> > > > Thanks for sharing these insights Gloria. :)
> > GG
> Yes, it is a huge place of need, my heart goes out to those people > because there is nothing about them that is crazy other then they are
> losing connection to this one reality and are not adjusting. And it does take someone with a > great deal of light and awareness to shut them down enough to get back
> into this third dimension mentality. Even then when they begin to > remember they want to venture back out into it, because inside they have yet to conquer this dimension of the experience. I am feeling that if
> these people were taught some basic knowledge about being out of body > and dealing with various aspects of spiritual manifestations that this
> could be corrected very fast. But, you see this is consciousness working > on consciousness, it is not mind trying to figure something out. Gloria
> > > > Blessings
> > Pam > >
> > > > _________________________
> > DO YOU YAHOO!? > > Get your free ATnospamyahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
> > --
> > Enter The Silence to Know God ... and... accept life as the teacher.
> Gloria Joy Greco > e-mail me at : lodpressATnospamintercomm.com and visit our homepages at:
> http://users.intercomm.com/larryn/ > &
> http://www.freeyellow.com/members/zg888/ > Hope you enjoy them!
--
Enter The Silence to Know God ... and... accept life as the teacher.
Gloria Joy Greco e-mail me at : lodpressATnospamintercomm.com and visit our homepages at:
http://users.intercomm.com/larryn/ &
http://www.freeyellow.com/members/zg888/ Hope you enjoy them!
DISCLAIMER!
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