1998/01/21 11:11
kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #70
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 70
Today's Topics:
Re: Einstein [ "Sen Ashanka"<sashankaATnospamaismi.ais.it ]
Dilbert [ amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us ]
Re: meditations [ Ann Morrison Fisher <annfisherATnospamstic ]
Re: meditations [ jeannegATnospamicon.net (Jeanne Garner) ]
Hey you (was Re: Introduction) [ Ann Morrison Fisher <annfisherATnospamstic ]
Re: Selfishness/Conversations [ Fastchnges <FastchngesATnospamaol.com> ]
Re: Rope. Water. Ghosts. was Re: Dig [ Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistres ]
Re: meditations [ Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistres ]
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:32:42 +0100
From: "Sen Ashanka"<sashankaATnospamaismi.ais.it>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Cc: AfperryATnospamaol.com, gkiefferATnospamnetaxis.com, Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com,
kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Einstein
Message-Id: <C1256593.0034046D.00ATnospamais.it>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Yes indeed, Einstein was a rare genius with a human touch.
It was his famous quote which went something like this :
"In all your equations and calculations, neven forget that the
ultimate goal is towards helping Mankind."
The exact words are a bit different, but the essense is this.
A bit off topic, but Einstein was a scientist who impacted
science like none ever did.
Cheers and love to all
Ashanka
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 08:11:04 -0600
From: amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Cc: amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us
Subject: Dilbert
Message-ID: <1326752324-30098017ATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Those of us who live in North America may have noticed that the cartoon
strip "Dilbert" has been featuring a new character called "the Skeptic."
In Tuesday's episode we see Dogbert and the Skeptic conversing. The Skeptic
is frowning and his arms are crossed. Dogbert is gesturing with his paws
and his tail is wagging:
"If your controlled tests have *never* found psychic powers, how do you
know the tests work for that sort of thing?"
In the next panel we see the Skeptic walking away as Dogbert continues:
"Isn't that like using a metal detector to find out if there are unicorns
in your sock drawer?"
The Skeptic:
"No!"
The last panel says "Later that night..."
We see the Skeptic wearing a pith helmet and holding a metal detector over
an open dresser drawer. A thought bubble coming from his head says:
"A skeptic checks *all* the drawers."
still here,
amckeon
(checking her drawers for unicorns, LOL)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 08:02:41 -0600
From: Ann Morrison Fisher <annfisherATnospamstic.net>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: meditations
Message-Id: <l03010d00b0eba8597c16ATnospam[207.71.50.208]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Tammy (Ray Morel <r.morelATnospamsympatico.ca>) wrote:
>Hi everyone, it's me again, the one who's not quite sure who she is or
>what she's doing yet,
or whether it's safe!
> but she sure is having fun! I don't really know
>very much about meditation techniques or anything but I'm making it up
>as I go along
That ain't the way it's done!
> and seem to be doing quite well.
How would you know?
>I am having fun with it though, so far and am making up my own
>meditations as I go along...is that dangerous? Is anything about
>meditating dangerous?
Well, off the top of my head, there's the danger of ego inflation. And the
danger of putting lots of energy in lower centers and not getting raised
any higher, in which case lots of things can go wrong with your personal
life.
>I spooked myself though, meditating in front of a mirror in my bedroom,
>can't really recall what spooked me, I think i saw a face in my face or
>something,
And the danger of getting a peek - or worse - into the unconscious!
>In one meditation I
>am a piece of confitti blowing in the wind. It's kind of like a slow
>motion roller coaster ride, feels fun.
Doesn't sound like you're meditating, sounds like you're day-dreaming.
Fantasizing. That means you're probably lolling around on the astral or
emotional plane, stimulating your lower centers.
Do you have kundalini manifestations? Are you impelled to do certain things?
Do you have any guidance? A voice, for instance? Or are you just playing
around and having fun?
There are safer ways to have fun.
> In another I am looking at a
>door, and I am trying to go through it but for some reason when I get to
>close I start spinning. I haven't made it close enough to the door yet
>to even look inside?
Don't. You might find what you glimpsed in the mirror.
Yes, I'm trying to scare you. I'm hoping you'll realize that it's possible
to mess up big-time.
> What is this all about? I thought I was supposed
>to be able to control my own meditations...
You are supposed to. But you have to learn. And you need a teacher.
>And as I have already told some of you I have been working on my brow
>chakra and the one in my chest.
Why the brow chakra? Why the chest chakra?
When you get into meditation, especially kundalini meditation, you're
playing with fire. And I mean that literally. You could get burned.
Did you read Sherry's story? She got hold of a high-powered meditation
method - without explanations. Here's what happened to her.
>At any rate after I started the meditation all kinds of weird things
>started happen to me. I could not eat meat because it made me sick, I had
>this craving for peanuts, wheat toast and orange juice. I lost 20 pounds
>(which that was good, I need to shead a few) I had such head trembling and
>shaking that my husband thought I was coming down with some kind of
>muscular disease. I had so much energy that I thought I would explode, I
>had to rake leaves to get rid of all the energy and get grounded. But had
>a really bad energy crash shortly after that and I was weepy for months. I
>thought I was losing my mind. Between the hallucinations and voices and
>some of the most horrible nightmares I have ever had in my life.
I know of one young man who thought if a certain meditation was good for
him, it would be even better if he did it for a long time. He's still in a
mental hospital.
You need to find a good teacher who will know what's happening to you and
will guide you. If you can't find a teacher, buy a book. Not a
sensational, off-the-wall book. Look for something that seems to be a
coherent traditional method by an experienced teacher. And follow what it
says!
Good luck!
Ann
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 08:33:49 -0600
From: jeannegATnospamicon.net (Jeanne Garner)
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: meditations
Message-Id: <199801211433.IAA11697ATnospamns2.icon.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Ann wrote:
>Yes, I'm trying to scare you. I'm hoping you'll realize that it's possible
>to mess up big-time.
I can't help but take exception to this. Do you realize these kinds of
statements plant fear-seeds in people's minds?
>You are supposed to. But you have to learn. And you need a teacher.
Maybe. Or maybe she has an inner teacher. Many people have awakened with
teachers, or with NO teachers.
>I know of one young man who thought if a certain meditation was good for
>him, it would be even better if he did it for a long time. He's still in a
>mental hospital.
I know of another young man who was doing no meditation whatever and also is
still in a mental hospital. I know other young men who meditate regularly
(with and without teachers) who are awakening beautifully. Why so down on
meditation?
>You need to find a good teacher who will know what's happening to you and
>will guide you. If you can't find a teacher, buy a book. Not a
>sensational, off-the-wall book. Look for something that seems to be a
>coherent traditional method by an experienced teacher. And follow what it
>says!
When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. It need not be a formal
teacher, or even a book. Most of us have a great "inner guidance system" if
we're open to it. It's hard to be open to it, however, if we're told that
it all has to come from outside of ourselve, via a teacher or book. It's
even harder to be open to it if we're instilled with fear.
Jeanne
==-* My stars!
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 08:22:29 -0600
From: Ann Morrison Fisher <annfisherATnospamstic.net>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Hey you (was Re: Introduction)
Message-Id: <l03010d00b0ebb46b907bATnospam[207.71.51.135]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
sassiATnospamworldnet.att.net (Jack) wrote:
Some of us have teachers, gurus or inner voices that guide us.
>Mine is a real wisecracker, so much so I'm thinking about naming her
>Loki as she won't tell me what her name is.
Try asking her, if she doesn't want to give her name, to give you any name
to call her by, so you won't have to say, "Hey you"!
Of course, maybe she likes Loki.
Ann
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:02:15 EST
From: Fastchnges <FastchngesATnospamaol.com>
To: AfperryATnospamaol.com
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Selfishness/Conversations
Message-ID: <be8eb7b0.34c60df9ATnospamaol.com>
In a message dated 98-01-20 09:33:36 EST, you write:
<<
Thanks for your note. My comment was aimed at confronting the issue raised by
the message you posted, not the person who posted it! As I said ...."without
much qualification...": on this List we have to take a posting at its face
value, we cannot always untuit the hidden sentiment of the originator. I'm
glad you do not subscribe to the view you quoted...without much qualification
:-)
Blessings,
Alan
>>
alan...
thanks for your comments back to me...specially the extra efort you spent in
AOL format.
but this is a perfect example of how 'we' sometimes read into things. between
the lines...both ways. perhaps the 'skeptic' sees the negatives that may lie
in between them. and perhaps the 'wise one' sees the wisdom they may hold.
this, IMHO, also holds true for the books we read...
the 'skeptic' looks for the false statements that might lie within...
the 'wise one' looks for the truth that is there...
perhaps it boils down to the way we look at life and the universe...
namaste
S. C. Stoner
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:47:04
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com>
To: Solar Lion <gtaATnospamcwnet.com>
Cc: <kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com>
Subject: Re: Rope. Water. Ghosts. was Re: Digest #49
Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980121104704.2ff72740ATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
<X-No-Archive: yes>
Hey Bob:
Thankyou for forwarding this to the list.. I was going to suggest an open
discussion, myself. .... and thanks for cleaning up the energy.. the one
you sent me direct after the shower post was dripping with the energy of
Hatred.. like a punch to the stomach. Even my slave commented on it.
Drew you out with the asphyxia story, eh? Good. Hoped to.
Whew! Some issues here!
Well, I'm open for debate..
Coz I know that once a mind thinks it has found truth, it stops thinking.
At 17:19 17/01/98 -0800, Solar Lion wrote:
>from established systems -
>ie: where kundalini training came from to begin with.
Well.. that might have been the birthplace of training, but I am trained
by the opened heart. It's wisdom is older than any training.
>
>patajalis sutras (one of hundreds of references)
>
>any excess of any of the senses (sense gratification)
>
>always leads to the same results
>
>1.short term memory depravation
>2.increasing inability to satisfy the senses leading
> to more extreme attempts often to the point of
> destruction of the mind and body.
>3.intense enthusiasm for projects with the
> increasing inability to finish them.
>4.increasing inability to "get the point"
> ie: deterioration of ability to understand concepts
>5.inability to control ego
>
Yes undeedy, I do bear some of those symptoms, some of the time.... and
I always have.
I even have a name for it: Attention Deficit Disorder.
Since I have gotten into SM, it is much much better.. because it is so
creatively challenging. I find smoking pot every day helps, too.. evens out
the attention and mood swings, and thanks to Goddess' blessing on this
aspect of my path, I get none of the expected negative effects.
My energy is like a fast rushing river, toss in a stick, it is swept away
by the flow, back to Goddess before any harm comes. No clouding.. it
enhances my connection with spirit.
Nice, that the Canadian Constitution preserves my right to use this herb
for my own healing without legal penalty. I get it from a local Medical
Marijuana compassion club.
I have meditated much on this, and been shown that this herb is possibly
the most sacred plant on a sacred Earth. We have THC receptors in our
brains, showing that we and the plant have a long history together.
Not a recommendation, but it works for me. I know it is a phase, and may
pass in it's own time.
ADD is also called, artists-genius disease.. it is a behavior pattern
common to very creative visionary people. That is what geniuses tend to be
like. Get over it!
Einstien was absentminded... would he have traded his visionary ability
to remember where he left his glasses? I doubt it.
In any case, trying to get someone with ADD or worse, ADHD to sit still
for 3 hours and think of nothing, is torture too cruel even for me! A
body-first, single point sensory-focus works much better.
>FYI - the tanrik has very little to do with sense gratification - it uses
>sexual methods but that is not the point.
I do believe that the point of my post.. the Shower one.. was to use
sexual stimulation to raise energy and get into an altered state.. that is
the purpose of Tantra, yes..? of course, it depends on the Tantra, too..
there are many varieties.
>and it is of extreme misuse to
>point its focus to self or other personalities.
Namaste: the Goddess in Me salutes the Goddess in you. See Goddess in
each other and serve that.. Goddess is in everyone and everything, where
else ought we look for Her, but in our hearts and in each other?
I don't quite understand your point.. is it not the path of Tantra to
look for Diety in the partner, and bring that energy out? Or in the Self,
if there is no partner.
Where is misuse? Wot?
>
>sense gratification in the long run always
>leaves you with nothing.
>Solar Lion (Bob)
Uh, huh, And isn't a "nothing" state, a Zen achievement?
Soo... what are you gonna take with you when you go, Bob?
Never seen a hearse followed by an armoured car..
Only your experiences. Will they be joyful or judgemental? Will you
rejoice in the life and body that Goddess gave you, or try to escape it,
shut it out, turn it off..
Your first post gave me an emotional reaction.. so I got grounded into
the witness state and asked within, "What would your suggested advice look
like, if I followed that path?" Open to information..
Goddess showed me a very colorless world. Then she showed me many, many
frustrated shut down barely alive folks I have met, in the past, who are
afraid to feel.. I sent them love.
You, I send a country song that comes into my head each time I opened
this post:
You gotta stop,
and smell the roses.
You gotta count your many blessings every day.
Yer gonna find yer way to heaven,
is a rough and rocky road,
if ya don't stop
to smell the roses
along the waaaaay.
Sending floral bouquets of love bombs to you.. Loosen up, eh?
Blessings, Mystress.
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 09:33:58
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com>
To: Ann Morrison Fisher <annfisherATnospamstic.net>
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: meditations
Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980121093358.38570936ATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 08:02 21/01/98 -0600, Ann Morrison Fisher wrote:
>Tammy (Ray Morel <r.morelATnospamsympatico.ca>) wrote:
>> but she sure is having fun! I don't really know
>>very much about meditation techniques or anything but I'm making it up
>>as I go along
>
>That ain't the way it's done!
But it worked for me! If you are trusting in Goddess to watch over you as
you play, then She will. You will be guided by curious impulses to try this
or that, and learn as you go. There is only fear itself, to fear.. dunno
why everybody wants to share spooky warnings.. it is a cosmic rule: you
won't be given anything you cannot handle.
>
>> Is anything about
>>meditating dangerous?
>
>Well, off the top of my head, there's the danger of ego inflation. And the
>danger of putting lots of energy in lower centers and not getting raised
>any higher, in which case lots of things can go wrong with your personal
>life.
This ego inflation idea..??? Goddess wants us to know we are Goddess..
like it says in a "Course in Miracles", "our playing small does not serve
the world". It only serves our limited ideas about ourselves.
>
>>I spooked myself though, meditating in front of a mirror in my bedroom,
>>can't really recall what spooked me, I think i saw a face in my face or
>>something,
I do the mirror game a lot! "Who's home today?"
But, you need to do it when you are deeply in the "Witness state",
emotionless.
Then, if any of them hold still long enough, you can have silent
conversations with them.. but you will get spooky faces, neanderthal,
trolls and faerie, aleins.. all the aspects of your multidimensional self..
it is a test to share love despite appearances. I even had Archangel
Michael show up once. he is very handsome..
>>In one meditation I
>>am a piece of confitti blowing in the wind. It's kind of like a slow
>>motion roller coaster ride, feels fun.
>
>Doesn't sound like you're meditating, sounds like you're day-dreaming.
Hmm.. sounds like you are taking a narrow view of meditation, Ann..
Much of my meditation reveolves around creative visualization. The
grounding excercise is visualization. Thru imagination, visualization, we
communicate our desires.
A confetti blowing, is an excercise in letting go, and surrendering to
Goddess winds blowing you where you need to be. Relax and trust that the
wind knows where it is going, you only need to let it carry you effortless.
Most excellent visualization excercise for K. folks struggling with
surrender.. Try it, Ann.
K. IS a slow motion rollercoaster ride.. it has biorhythm- like waves,
peaks and lows. Thoughts create. She is creating a path of effortless fun
surrender to a higher stronger power, with this.
>
>Yes, I'm trying to scare you. I'm hoping you'll realize that it's possible
>to mess up big-time.
Stop scaring the newbies, Ann.. she is protected by her faith and
innocence.
Like, your warning about the intensity of my grounding website: I could
not describe it's creation or working, because it would limit the
experiences of folks visiting it.
Do not project that everyone will have an intense experience of the
grounding page, just coz you did. Each experience of it that I have read
so far, is unique. It gives to each, what they need. You needed some
intensity.. to others, it is like a gentle cloud of light. There was even
one, who was directed to continue to use the visualization to cleanse, but
that it was not yet time to wake the Serpents.
This body typed the page.. the rest came from Goddess, and She decides
what each person's experience of it will be, and She never gives us more
than we can handle.
>
>> What is this all about? I thought I was supposed
>>to be able to control my own meditations...
>
>You are supposed to. But you have to learn. And you need a teacher.
I never hadda teacher, except books..
If I am in control of the meditation, then it will happen as I will
it..BORING!
... but if I am co-creating with Goddess.. She has Her own agenda.. I
surrender to it.
>Did you read Sherry's story? She got hold of a high-powered meditation
>method - without explanations. Here's what happened to her.
<..> But had
>>a really bad energy crash shortly after that and I was weepy for months. I
>>thought I was losing my mind. Between the hallucinations and voices and
>>some of the most horrible nightmares I have ever had in my life.
>
>I know of one young man who thought if a certain meditation was good for
>him, it would be even better if he did it for a long time. He's still in a
>mental hospital.
Nothing to fear, but fear itself. These two are folks that let their fear
run away with them. Fear creates. Focus on Love and trust. When fear gets
out of control, it is because we are not choosing faith. Give the fear up
to Goddess, to be reshaped into beauty.
>
>You need to find a good teacher who will know what's happening to you and
>will guide you. If you can't find a teacher, buy a book.
If you get scared, it can be good to have a teacher to reassure you that
everything is alright.. but some teachers will expect you to take on their
fears and limits, along with their wisdom. That's the part that kept
stopping me from surrendering my path to another human, for more than a
weekend workshop, at least.
If you are guided to tke a teacher, then one will appear in your life, and
Goddess will make the tempation irresissatble.. Temptation does come from
the Serpent.. She guides us by our passions. Follow your bliss.
In the meantime, we are here.
Blessings, Mystress.
Mystress Angelique Serpent,
Dominant Experiential Facilitator.
Website= http://www.domin8rex.com/serpent
:D ;) :0 :) ;P :0 ;) :D :0 :) ;P :0 ;) :)
Common sense and a sense of humor are the same thing, moving at
different speeds. A sense of humor is just common sense, dancing.
-- Clive James
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