1998/01/08 13:45
kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #18
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 18
Today's Topics:
Scientific Wonders [ Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu> ]
Re: Scientific Wonders [ Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin. ]
Re: Scientific Wonders [ Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin. ]
Read this BEFORE the above [ Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin. ]
Re: Scientific Wonders [ freda <fredaATnospamblarg.net> ]
Re: Spine chills... [ Druout <DruoutATnospamaol.com> ]
Back pain [ Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin. ]
Re: leaving [ Druout <DruoutATnospamaol.com> ]
Re: Spine chills... [ Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin. ]
Re:. Summary [ Afperry <AfperryATnospamaol.com> ]
Re: Science/Kundalini ( Long ) [ Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin. ]
(Re: Scientific Wonders [ "Melissa Pettigrew" <pettigrewmATnospamgac ]
Re: Science/Kundalini [ Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin. ]
teaching and learning. [ John Halonen <halonenATnospamflash.net> ]
Re: Science/Kundalini [ "Melissa Pettigrew" <pettigrewmATnospamgac ]
RE: Science/Kundalini [ Mike Stickles <msticklesATnospamantalys.co ]
Re: Scientific Wonders [ Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu> ]
Re: Travels to the other side of rea [ sassiATnospamworldnet.att.net (Jack) ]
Re: Spine chills... [ Druout <DruoutATnospamaol.com> ]
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 09:11:36 -1000
From: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
cc: danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu
Subject: Scientific Wonders
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.95q.980108090113.11238B-100000ATnospamuhunix5>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Dear Dan :
I am interested in what you write about what you have discovered about K.
people on this list.. You give a perfect example for Mr. Kieffer and
others of your persuasion of the narrowness of the scientific perspective
and why it is not possible to give much to science with myopic lenses.
You postulate presumably for something you plan to write:
>>1) People who experience kundalini have a time when they first started
having kundalini experiences. This time is called an awakening. An
awakening is a lucid dream that is overlayed on top of reality. The dream
is based on things in traditional reality that most people don't notice in
addition to having large amounts of non-sensory-related, psychological
dream-type elements that vary from person to person.>>
[Your understanding is as superficial and lacking dimension as it is
possible to get.. but then it seems you are an Engineer! What to expect?
I wish you luck in your next lifetime...and pray for your awakening so you
will be ableto truly experience what you are analysing.]
AND believe it or not, but it deteriorates from this point... Oh LOL!
>>
2) After awakening, the person has learned how to lucid dream and can
later willfully experience states of mind similar to what the person had
experienced during the awakening experience.
3) Most kundalini experiencers are oversensitive to their bodies and
experience pain more intensely because they focus on it.
4) Kundalini experiencers can be detached and avoid emotion.
5) Most experiencers have "fantasy-prone personalities" (icky, clinical
term), have high hypnotic ability, and excel in autohypnosis ability.>>>
>>
Seems to be about time for your departure... if this is all you have
achieved.
*****
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:27:23 -0500 (EST)
From: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
To: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu>
cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Scientific Wonders
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980108141548.6462A-100000ATnospambergh.ummu.umich.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> people on this list.. You give a perfect example for Mr. Kieffer and
> others of your persuasion of the narrowness of the scientific perspective
> and why it is not possible to give much to science with myopic lenses.
I experience too much fear when I reject logic. I permit myself
to experience all other emotions. I try to control anger to enact change.
I permit love to flow freely. I try to control sadness to enact change.
Sometimes I enjoy just the state of experience intense emotion, so I don't
act immediately. I probably would try to control jealousy to give me the
energy to add to my personality those aspects of anothers' for which I am
jealous. I cannot channel fear into anything. My body becomes alarmed
and vibrates out of control. If I permit fear to grow, it might cause a
stroke. Instead, I use logic to calm my fear. Am I doing anything that
you would suggest improvement upon? By control, I don't mean I focus my
attention on the emotion and attempt to edit it. I generate thoughts that
will release the emotion in a productive way.
> >>1) People who experience kundalini have a time when they first started
> having kundalini experiences. This time is called an awakening. An
> awakening is a lucid dream that is overlayed on top of reality. The dream
> is based on things in traditional reality that most people don't notice in
> addition to having large amounts of non-sensory-related, psychological
> dream-type elements that vary from person to person.>>
> [Your understanding is as superficial and lacking dimension as it is
> possible to get.. but then it seems you are an Engineer! What to expect?
Please reword or reexpress what you learn from this statement to
better reflect "dimension" and "depth."
> I wish you luck in your next lifetime...and pray for your awakening so you
> will be ableto truly experience what you are analysing.]
Could you tell me more specifically what I am missing? I am 20
and have not given up on my quest for enlightenment. I just do not feel
that I can reach enlightenment more quickly by believing in the kundalini
experience. I do not even know what enlightenment is yet.
> AND believe it or not, but it deteriorates from this point... Oh LOL!
Forgive me, but can you reword or inspire me.
> 2) After awakening, the person has learned how to lucid dream and can
> later willfully experience states of mind similar to what the person had
> experienced during the awakening experience.
> 3) Most kundalini experiencers are oversensitive to their bodies and
> experience pain more intensely because they focus on it.
> 4) Kundalini experiencers can be detached and avoid emotion.
> 5) Most experiencers have "fantasy-prone personalities" (icky, clinical
> term), have high hypnotic ability, and excel in autohypnosis ability.>>>
> Seems to be about time for your departure... if this is all you have
> achieved.
Do you believe I will learn more if I leave than if I stay?
Dan
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:36:13 -0500 (EST)
From: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
To: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu>
cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Scientific Wonders
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980108143219.6462B-100000ATnospambergh.ummu.umich.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
I believe I understand kundalini scientifically. I have not read
Bentov's paper yet, but I would like to compare my explanation his. I
include something about the reason why the system of a genius is more
fragile than others' and why kundalini may lead to genius. I would like
to give this explanation, but it does not seem that this list is open to
scientific explanations since I have yet to get a supportive word for my
scientific thoughts.
Dan
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:41:05 -0500 (EST)
From: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Read this BEFORE the above
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980108143728.6462C-100000ATnospambergh.ummu.umich.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
My awakening story involves science. For this, I apologize in
advance.
It is also extremely lengthly (41000 letters) and emotional as I
cried a little as I wrote it. I have not cried in a long time.
If you are offended by the things which I write that involve
science, please feel free to refrain from reading or replying to it.
Thank you.
Dan
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 11:46:10 -0800
From: freda <fredaATnospamblarg.net>
To: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
CC: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu>, kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Scientific Wonders
Message-ID: <34B52D02.1A2FATnospamblarg.net>
Dan asks:
> Do you believe I will learn more if I leave than if I stay?
>
Dan,
you sound like my daughters!
When they wanted to move out for the first time, everyone had to go
through this "ritual" of their rebelion in order to "justify" their
departure.
It is a battle within yourself: to BE who you are without losing the
security of the "pack" [so to speak].
-Nothing wrong with a pack-its just that some feel they have to go it
alone, and thats okay!)
I'm betting your going to do exactly what YOU want to do. [Just like
those darn kids...]
And you'll learn.....
BE-IS-AM ...manifesting again...
http://www.blarg.net/~freda/01rg/hm/frhm.htm
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:37:58 EST
From: Druout <DruoutATnospamaol.com>
To: jeremy_chevrierATnospamccmlink.dph.sf.ca.us, kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Spine chills...
Message-ID: <31990e4.34b52b17ATnospamaol.com>
Dear Jeremy,
Don't know what it means, but I have these lightening "shivers" that go up
the spine and hit the brain in a pleasurable explosion about 2-3 times a day.
These started about 6 months after the k began. They are different from the
wave/bliss states I experience usually waking me from sleep.
They are probably a cleansing mechanism to clear out any "blocks" Only a
guess.
I suspect many of us have or have had this particular experience.
Love, Hillary
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:49:20 -0500 (EST)
From: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Back pain
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980108144658.6696A-100000ATnospambergh.ummu.umich.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
The solution to the phantom back pain that comes and goes is to
rest the brain. Try concentrating on the blue chackra to activate it.
Think blue, and relax. This works for me. Could someone please tell me
if it works for them? If I chose to write a scientific explanation, I
will include something on back pain.
Dan
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:52:51 EST
From: Druout <DruoutATnospamaol.com>
To: danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu, fredaATnospamblarg.net
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com, kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: leaving
Message-ID: <260236e9.34b52e95ATnospamaol.com>
Dear Dan,
Hey, you're leaving before we really get to know you!
All we know is you are a math genius, logical, scientific and you want to help
the world.
What were your experiences with K? Do you have anything to teach US??
Many of us come from logical backgrounds but now do not close off our minds to
the esoteric.
Love, Hillary
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:52:59 -0500 (EST)
From: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
To: Druout <DruoutATnospamaol.com>
cc: jeremy_chevrierATnospamccmlink.dph.sf.ca.us, kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Spine chills...
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980108145036.6696B-100000ATnospambergh.ummu.umich.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> Don't know what it means, but I have these lightening "shivers" that go up
> the spine and hit the brain in a pleasurable explosion about 2-3 times a day.
> These started about 6 months after the k began. They are different from the
> wave/bliss states I experience usually waking me from sleep.
A man experiences "lightning storms" in the brain if he has too
many intense orgasms in a short period of time. They feel like electrical
shocks in the brain. This may be just within my family though.
Dan
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:42:42 EST
From: Afperry <AfperryATnospamaol.com>
To: danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu
Cc: Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re:. Summary
Message-ID: <12aaaee4.34b52c33ATnospamaol.com>
Dear Dan,
I'm very pleased at least that you said you were listening. Earlier you seemed
to be implying that, having learnt all there is to learn on the subject, you
were no longer open to it any more - and that attitude I found sad. Not wrong,
mind you, it's a common-enough attitude but you are doing yourself no
favours. This List consists simply of human beings, each different and each
offering something of their own. It may not all resonate with you, but then
why should it? No doubt we all gain from it what is right for us individually,
but at the same time we are interacting with others, equally as individual as
ourselves and sharing our experiences, views, life and loves, for the benefit
of the whole. Please don't condemn the whole just because it's not aimed at
your requirements. You need perhaps to be more selective in what you tune into
in the List i.e. use that Delete button more!
You will get all the teaching you need when you are ready for it, so keep your
eyes peeled and your mind open :-)
And whatever you do, may love and peace be with you,
Alan
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:55:27 -0500 (EST)
From: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
To: Jack <sassiATnospamworldnet.att.net>
cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Science/Kundalini ( Long )
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980108145408.6696C-100000ATnospambergh.ummu.umich.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> Synchronistic episodes
> Telepathy including : Empathic ( bi - locative )
> Remote viewing
> Visual
> Aural
> Telekinesis ( PSI )
> Resonance Attunement ( 7-13 Hz )
> Healing
I like your catagorizing. I agree with you.
Dan
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:56:45 EST5EDT
From: "Melissa Pettigrew" <pettigrewmATnospamgacsrv.gactr.uga.edu>
To: Kundalini-l <Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: (Re: Scientific Wonders
Message-Id: <199801081957.OAA05790ATnospametoho.gactr.uga.edu>
sorry list...i accidently sent my response just to dan..it's for the
list..
melissa
------- Forwarded Message Follows -------
From: Self <pettigrewm.IndStudy.Gactr>
To: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: Scientific Wonders
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:54:14 EST5EDT
> I believe I understand kundalini scientifically. I have not read
> Bentov's paper yet, but I would like to compare my explanation his. I
> include something about the reason why the system of a genius is more
> fragile than others' and why kundalini may lead to genius. I would like
> to give this explanation, but it does not seem that this list is open to
> scientific explanations since I have yet to get a supportive word for my
> scientific thoughts.
hi dan. i've been reading your emails with interest..you remind me of
my exboyfriend...a mathmetician and computer progammer who wanted
everything..even matters spiritual(which i consider kundalini to
be) neatly explained and documented....it made him feel better. it
justified things
your "scientific" approach to
kundalini is not something i find offensive...it just seems that
science doesn't always have room for what cannot be neatly tied up in
an equation or paper neat package of explanations. personally...to me
the scientific approach leaves out the spirit part..the room for the
magic..the unknown....the true essence of the spirit...
so...it kinda come across in your emails that you are searching for
something ..yet your recitation and offer to explain psychic
phemonena comes across as an attempt to "debunk"...again, this is
just what i'm perceiving from what you write.
i think we are all here for varying reasons..but mostly just to
read..discuss and challange ourselves and each other in hopefully a
positive manner so we can continue our highly individual yet
spiritual paths.
it's hard to come to a list like this and expect the group to react
positively to someone who says they have the whole thing figured out
on paper ...certainly you have to expect a resistance to this...
learning..spirituality..kundalini...hey, it's all an ongoing
process....i think we are led to places for a reason...and sometimes
we may go 'hey, there is nothing here for me."....and then later see
the relevance...
perhaps you can continue with what it is you are comfortable
with..your scientific style...it seems you are clinging to it a
bit..but perhaps just leave a little room in your science for
something..unexplained..unexpected..the surprise..the magic..the
essence of the energy of life..
just some thoughts..
light,
melissa
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:58:36 -0500 (EST)
From: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
To: Joseph Miller <joemillerATnospamhotmail.com>
cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Science/Kundalini
Message-ID: <Pine.HPP.3.96.980108145747.6696D-100000ATnospambergh.ummu.umich.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> Replying to:
> >Would anyone disagree with the statement that *knowing* does not
> >easily translate into mathematical symbols since it is a matter of
> >the heart, .....
>
> disagree with the statement that "knowing" is a matter of the heart!
>
> Knowing is intuition. Intuition is not a heart issue. Because we
Is intuition a brain issue?
Dan
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 15:06:58 -0800
From: John Halonen <halonenATnospamflash.net>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: teaching and learning.
Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980108150655.0079ddb0ATnospampop.flash.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I would teach, but all I can offer is myself.
I will listen and understand what I am able.
I will open myself to a higher self to guide me.
Only until I know myself, may I know others.
I feel as if I can grow everyday.
Never limited.
And still be humble.
And smile and say hello. :)
And tell a guest to come back when they need something.
May all the love I have go out to all of you.
Of course it can. :)
Oh, and always be patient.
A good quality for immortal spirits to learn. 8-)
Blessings!!!
John Halonen
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:08:42 EST5EDT
From: "Melissa Pettigrew" <pettigrewmATnospamgacsrv.gactr.uga.edu>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Science/Kundalini
Message-Id: <199801082008.PAA06971ATnospametoho.gactr.uga.edu>
> > Replying to:
> > >Would anyone disagree with the statement that *knowing* does not
> > >easily translate into mathematical symbols since it is a matter of
> > >the heart, .....
> >
> > disagree with the statement that "knowing" is a matter of the heart!
> >
> > Knowing is intuition. Intuition is not a heart issue. Because we
> Is intuition a brain issue?
Dan
daaaannnn... you silly. of course you jest here..right? if not, do
you not believe in intuition since it cannot be measure with a guy in
a white coat with a fancy meter? :)
light..
melissa
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:17:20 -0500
From: Mike Stickles <msticklesATnospamantalys.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: RE: Science/Kundalini
Message-ID: <B982B2DC7C0ED111804600805F850AB220D298ATnospamEX-DENVER-U1>
Content-Type: text/plain
Couple of snips:
> > Knowing is intuition. Intuition is not a heart issue.
> Is intuition a brain issue?
Intuition, IMHO, is neither. When my intuition "speaks", it seems to be
an awareness that the various aspects of my being below the
logical/conscious level (heart, spirit, extrasensory awareness, etc)
have all "come to the same conclusion". However, "knowing" I would not
equate with intuition, since for me "knowing" is when my
logical/conscious mind and my intuition agree. This could be just a
matter of definitions, however.
- Mike
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 10:32:32 -1000
From: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu>
To: Daniel James Giszczak <danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu>
cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Scientific Wonders
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.95q.980108093113.11238D-100000ATnospamuhunix5>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Dear Daniel:
Thank you for your letter. I had to poke fun at you, for you really do
embody the very thing we have been discussing with Gene that it is not
possible to understand Kundalini through science or the scientific mind.
You provided sublime evidence. So Thank you for this.
What you write to me seems incredibly tragic. Yet I am sure you are not
alone and in you is the human dilemma at this time when we leave
behind the Age of Pisces and enter the Age of Aquarius. For what has been
safe and clear in your world so far, will not take you very far much
longer. All the education that has been given to you is a mirage,
an insipid destroyer of your own natural abilities. I hate to tell you
this.. especially since I am in tertiary education myself, so I
knowwhereof I speak. Who you are has been conditioned and trained out of
you, so that you can come up with
these clever analyses which have the effect of killing the truth stone
dead. Your professors will be happy, for they are in the same illusion of
security and correctness as you are.. so you belong to an exclusive little
club and you feel reassured.
But to the people who have surrendered to the
Kundalini.. you appear to be on an imaginary ship floating in an imaginary
world and oblivious to the fact that there is no ocean beneath your boat.
But you are very YOUNG .. and there is much more to come in your life.. so
do not despair. You in fact have stumbled shall we say, into a special
temple and though you may not know the words of the chants and prayers,
you are absorbing them and all will awaken at the right time. Take heart.
> I experience
too much fear when I reject logic. I permit myself
In this statement dear young man, you have conjured up my intense
compassion. It conjures up a picture of someone mentioned in Arnold
Mindell's books about Multiple Sclerosis and how the patient was very
much into CONTROL. When Arnold gave him permission to surrender and not
control, his MS went completely away... but the patient was too afraid of
his lack of control over his life, so he went right back and got MS again.
He felt safer. So the body will counterbalance the strictures of the will
and mind it seems in this case. I would recommend sufi dancing for you..
or some kind of free expression physically that would get you to stop
controlling so much.. just be free and light... go to a meadow and take
off your shoes (yeh even in the snow) and just DANCE! Feel the energy of
the earth and the elementals pouring through your body.. follow your
intuition and let it carry you away. Failing this, try
Chi Gong... and let that do it for you. I would say this kind of activity
is essential for you.
> to experience all other emotions. I try to control anger to enact change.
> I permit love to flow freely. I try to control sadness to enact change.
All of this smacks of control, Control, CONTROL! CAn you hear this?
LET GO.. Goddess Shakti will come and slap you BIG TIME if you will not do
it. She is the dominator - She owns you - you are HER stuff. Get on your
knees and ask for mercy... get down and weep and ask HER to come and heal
your fears and your obsessions. You control nothing... that is the most
important lesson you can learn...unless SHE allows it.
> Sometimes I enjoy just the state of experience intense emotion, so I don't
> act immediately. I probably would try to control jealousy to give me the
> energy to add to my personality those aspects of anothers' for which I am
> jealous. I cannot channel fear into anything. My body becomes alarmed
> and vibrates out of control. If I permit fear to grow, it might cause a
> stroke. Instead, I use logic to calm my fear.
Well that works for a while, but it does not last does it?
Am I doing anything that
> you would suggest improvement upon? By control, I don't mean I focus my
> attention on the emotion and attempt to edit it. I generate thoughts that
> will release the emotion in a productive way.
Sounds hopeful and you have awareness of all this.. but ...
Dear Dan It seems your mind is too obsessed with control.
Here is what you do. Go get a book by Ramana Maharshi, on Advaita.
If you cannot do that, then listen and follow this advice. It worked for
me so profoundly that I no longer have fear.. it is gone.. and I hve had
some very scary freaky stuff happen to me.. NO FEAR. I can feel others'
fear mind you.. but inside me.. as mine.. no...
This was given to me by a lady called Gangaji -a disciple of Ramana
Maharshi and JL Poonja recently deceased -- there is a web site for
her at www.gangaji.org so you can find out if she is going to be around
your area in the near future...and check her out. But do not make any
statements like the ones you wrote on this list, or she will throw
something at you.. usually a pillow.*** Best keep quiet until you get the
gist of the questions which are usually of a very advanced and enlightened
nature from a very serious audience.
HOW TO DESTROY FEAR:
This requires a very honest ability to enter pain, stay in it and be able
to accept whatever is appearing.. completely truthfully.
DAN I think you can do this from what you write.
Wait until you feel FEAR. Go into the fear and overcome aversion
to it by going into the most painful part of it. Sit in the deepest part
of the fear. Then imagine this fear is a being and ask:
"WHO IS AFRAID?" Then wait for a response. Be honest. Wait for
something to answer. Try to not create an answer.. but wait for the
deepest answer from the fear. It will come. Be vigilant.
Repeat this until you hear something like "I AM." Then you know
you hve identified the entity that has fear. (This isthe deep memory
inside you from a fearful experience of your past... that is answering..
not a thing exactly.. but it could be say a little child's voice from when
you were afraid as a child etc. ) Don't freak out.. stay calm.
THen you ask "WHO is the 'I'?" This one requires scrupulous
attention and focus for it will start to become very strange at this
point if you are like me. For the entity is now dissolving into
nothingness... and will sort of take with it all kinds of mad fantasies
and elements that you might mistake for the core of 'I', so you keep
watching and not reacting to it. Just keep repeating "Who is I?" and if
you are honest and truly vigilant of the answer.. the answer will come
that there is NO FEAR and indeed there is NO 'I' having it either.. it is
a profound experience... beyond language.
Thus fear is gone forever.. and the truth of who you are is also revealed.
----------------------------------------------------
This isthe most freeing thing that I have ever encountered.
I do hope that your controlling mind will give you peace in this
exercise.. and that it might awaken you to all that you have the potential
to be. But 20 is still very young for spiritual awareness... after 21 I
think it gets better. REad Rudolph Steiner on this.. you acquire another
sheath to cover your emotional body.
> Could you tell me more specifically what I am missing? I am 20
> and have not given up on my quest for enlightenment. I just do not feel
> that I can reach enlightenment more quickly by believing in the kundalini
> experience. I do not even know what enlightenment is yet.
WELL if you follow the above exercise to the true goal.. you will have
enlightenment.. in a nutshell. This is cutting to the chase as they say..
you need nothing else Dan. I am sure that Harsha and Anandajyoti will
concur here. Forget all the wild rides to enlightenment.. just take the
short cut which I just expounded here.. Save yourself many years of toil.
What you discover is who you really are. It is not decorative or even
something you can brag about to others.. but it gets the job done -
Lickety split!
> Do you believe I will learn more if I leave than if I stay?
> Dan
What do you think? What did you want to learn? I teach students your age
all day long.. and I give them something that they don't expect to learn
from a professor. I give them a warm psychic hug every time they come to
my class and I tell them inside that they are able to do ANYTHING.. and
that they are the very essence of Shiva (God) in form. Then I watch them
blossom and grow in my garden... and behold the end of the semester comes
and they look back at who they were before my class, at what they learned
and they cannot verbalise what it was exactly that they learned.. but they
know they changed in some major way. This could happen to you if you stick
around here.. for there is not a more loving list I have found than this
one. Take care. Ruth
*****
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 20:34:56 GMT
From: sassiATnospamworldnet.att.net (Jack)
To: lvdsATnospamstdin.gatelink.fr.net
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Travels to the other side of reality.
Message-ID: <34ba386c.9906840ATnospammailhost.worldnet.att.net>
I would like to stay conscient at the metro travel so i could have the
whole story! _PLEASE_ if someone can help in anyway: i beg you to tell
me. I have this problem since more than 20 years.
Well you could try a mneomic. Stare at your hands wide open palms
facing you. At some point in your travel do this again. Helps when
remembering later. Also, I find those flashing lights on awakening
from sleep and then meditating in the third eye. Try meditating when
your not tired.
...and, is this too much to ask to explain me how to decide of the
destination of the metro?!? ...As there are places i have been where
i would like very much to go back! :-))
Don't we all ! When your inner eye begins to manifest impessions try
impressing your own vision of where you want to go then blur
everything in the background. Step back and let your inner eye go
where it may, some say this technique works for them. I've haven't
been able to control it like this, unfortunately.
Jack
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:28:52 EST
From: Druout <DruoutATnospamaol.com>
To: danjgATnospamengin.umich.edu
Cc: jeremy_chevrierATnospamccmlink.dph.sf.ca.us, kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: Spine chills...
Message-ID: <8c9548f4.34b53705ATnospamaol.com>
Dear Dan,
I don't find any correlation with spine chills and orgasm.
Thanks anyway!
Hillary
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