1997/09/29 12:54
kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #475
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 97 : Issue 475
Today's Topics:
Hello, LIST MYSTRESS !!!
Re: Pentecostal Kundalini
Light Dripping
Re: Questions, questions...
Kundalini and Holy Spirit (was Pentecostal Kundalini)
Re: Introduction
Re: ways of the heart
Re: Dream
Re: Kundalini and Holy Spirit (was Pentecostal Kundalini)
Awakening and Kundalini
Questions follow up
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 12:25:34 -0500
From: MrNamasteATnospamwebtv.net (MrNamaste)
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Hello, LIST MYSTRESS !!!
Message-Id: <199709291725.KAA17092ATnospammailtod-2.alma.webtv.net>
Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY=WebTV-Mail-2130949169-2475
Thank you for sharing your impressions of whom you believe to be fully
awakened in our mass popular culture. I appreciate this information
VERY much because it coincides beautifully with what I was ASSURED to
be the case by a person with the FULL K in my life.
Now I can tell that person that that the actual List Facilitator echoed
the precise same thing. (!!! ) This will be of GREAT comfort and
value and meaning to that individual, (who, along with me is NO
"kundalini Scholar.) Thanks again.
I bring now to your attention this attachment. It is my fault that
David's questions were no addressed by the group --- for I dragged the
k-list into a discussion of moral relativity. For this I feel remorse,
and would like to rectify it, by humbly asking that you consider
seriously my request to re-submit his letter to the k-list.
When you read it, you may be alarmed, as I was that it was the SECOND
time he had submitted it.
Thank you so much List Mystress for all the work and time and attention
you are given to us in the midst of a large Global Awakening.
Peace and Joy be yours.
Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 15:28:20 -0500
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Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 12:05:06
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
From: David Hodges <davidATnospamrecol.com> (by way of Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com>)
Subject: Is this kundalini
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I sent this to the list but it hasn't shown up yet. I am a new subscriber,
maybe it didn't go through? Anyway, if you could relay this to the list I'd
appreciate it as I would be really interested in any feedback I might get!
Thanks.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi -
I just joined the list after reading the info on the web site and I would
like to relate some experiences I have had to get feedback that any of you
might have.
On April 30th of this year I was lying in bed with a headache when I was
filled with a great rush of energy. It made me stretch and stiffen my spine
to the utmost. Afterwards I had all sorts of insights about my life but
later couldn't remember them. The headache disappeared.
After that, over the months from then until now all sorts of changes
began appearing in my life, as follows:
1. I felt inexplicably drawn to do Yoga and began doing it every day.
2. I had been meditating about once a week and fell the extreme desire to
meditate every day, sometimes twice a day, which I have been doing.
3. I felt the need to give up tobacco (occasional cigars and pipes)
because I became very sensitive to what it was doing to my body. I gave it
up very easily.
4. I felt the need to give up caffeinated coffee which I did very easily.
5. I felt that I could go off the anti-depressant which I had been taking
for 3 years. I have done so and so far all is fine.
6. I felt more interested in vegetarianism and have given up red meat and
want to go further. For lunch instead of a sandwhich I get salad and
certain things seem to appeal to me on certain days, today it was alfalfa
bean sprouts!
7. Starting in August I had this weird pain in my left hip which
sometimes would radiate down to my knee. It lasted about 3 weeks and is now
mostly better.
8. I have had two more infillings of energy, one while meditating with a
dear friend, the other just two nights ago while meditating with the same
spine-straightening effect and also my arms needed to be held wide!
Afterwards I felt "nothing special" but the following day my emotions were
all in an uproar, I wanted to cry half the time (I am a middle-aged
sensible male by the way who doesn't cry very often!)
9. I am exasperating my mate because I have conceived the desire to leave
the suburban lifestyle we live and move to Vermont and live communally with
spiritually minded friends.
These are some but not all of the changes of the last few months. If this
is kundalini, does anyone have any advice, suggestions, encouragement,
whatever? The whole thing has been pretty wonderful and not a bit
frightening, by the way.
Thanks,
David
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 10:29:02 -0700
From: Kurt Keutzer <keutzerATnospamsynopsys.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Cc: keutzerATnospamsynopsys.com
Subject: Re: Pentecostal Kundalini
Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970929102900.00720accATnospampcpo-1>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Gordon J. Bakken writes:
>How I heard about Kundalini.
> I was raised in a Pentecostal family. In my youth I felt that I had
>experienced the Pentecostal/Charismatic experience. Later, I left the
>church to begin my "spiritual search". I still think that experience
>was real, but have come to believe that the Pentecostals did not
>understand what they were experiencing..
My only childhood religious exposure was in a pentecostal church as well. I
have often wondered how such a precious gift as the holy spirit could be so
lost amidst so many prejuidices and so much bigotry but I do remember
clearly one pentecostal sunday school teacher that I had. She was a
wonderful woman who despite being very poor was very generous to her sunday
school class. I used to watch her carefully when during the sermon her eyes
would roll back in her head and her face would light up with peace. It
would be 10 years before I would recognize this again as the characteristic
of samadhi. My family also had a few true mystics. But it was an early
lesson about how an individual from the pulpit can serve as a channel for
so much shakti without any of it reaching or transforming their heart.
> My sister reciently told me about a Pentecostal revival in Brownsville
>Assy, Pensaola, Fl. I searched the web. This is their site.
>Found another site which said Pentecostalism and Kundalini were the same
>thing. Searched this new word, "Kundalini" and am now on this e-mail
>listing. Enjoy it. That site is:
>
>COMPARING KUNDALINI YOGA AND TORONTO BLESSING / BROWNSVILLE
>http://www.balaams-ass.com/journal/warnings/charhind.htm#COMPARING
>
>Other sites say this also (search: Pentecostal and Kundalini) What do
>you think? Gordon
I had thought for some time to try to do an article going step by step
through the symptoms of kundalini and those of receiving the pentecost -
then I found someone did it for me! Taking my own FAQ and dutifully
cross-referencing it to signs of the pentecost - unfortunately their
approach is very critical of both phenomenon but something tells me the net
result of their site will be more good than biad.
I'm curious if anyone out there has found a good environment for kundalini
awakening among pentecosts and charismatics?
Kurt
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 13:45:40 -0400
From: PaulATnospamlouisville.lib.ky.us
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Light Dripping
Message-Id: <E0xFjt6-0000O2-00ATnospamiglou1>
I have also noticed the phenomena of light dripping. The first time I
noticed it was as I was finishing a holotropic breathwork. The light was
white. It has since occured infrequently during meditation or after I
wake up from a vivid dream.
Any info is welcome.
Paul
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 13:53:49 -0400
From: chelseaATnospamsuperaje.com (Dominic & Maureen Marando)
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Questions, questions...
Message-Id: <19970929175353Z19423-136+124ATnospamsuperaje.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>To: Bliss <readyATnospamdircon.co.uk> (by way of Mystress Angelique Serpent
<mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com>)
>From: chelseaATnospamsuperaje.com (Dominic & Maureen Marando)
>Subject: Re: Questions, questions...
>
>Dear Bliss...(and her boyfriend)
>
>
>When I was fifteen I tried marijuana in the schoolyard and hated it.
>So ends my life with drugs.(I'm 34 now)
>I didn't ask to experince K energy...it just happened. I am a "normal"
(*grin) mother of two with a full-time job, lots of friends....love to
dance, laugh and pay the bills.
>(OK maybe not LOVE to pay the bills).
>K had me question everything, but now I understand it as a transformative
biological AND spiritual energy as body, mind soul are all interconnected.
>I HIGHLY RECOMMEND YOU GET AHOLD OF THE BOOK "A FARTHER SHORE" by Dr.
Yvonne Kason MD., who had k awaken after a near-death experience and
counsels patients in her practise. There is a WHOLE CHAPTER FOR
FIRENDS/SPOUSES of those experiencing k.
>It will give you both your sanity, and trust in the creator, back.
>Love
>Mo :-)
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 10:51:02 -0700
From: Kurt Keutzer <keutzerATnospamsynopsys.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Kundalini and Holy Spirit (was Pentecostal Kundalini)
Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970929105101.00765db4ATnospampcpo-1>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Gloria in repsonce to Gordon and David (on Pentecostal Kundalini)
> This is true, and what you describe is very accurate, but people even
>in the not knowing what was happening were experiencing and opening up
>to kundalini. Life is the teacher, and when this experience came to you
>from outside, it also took you inside. The preacher no doubt doesn't
>understand what the outcome of this is, it is just understood that the
>Holy Spirit is working ...which it is. But, the deep inner understanding
>hasn't come through. Now you see it was a step, and what it released
>inside of you was awareness which made your spiritual walk ever more
>powerful. Everything is used and has purpose.
> Kundalini is the interior prana, divine energy, Holy Spirit drops down
>while kundalini is coming up. That likely started the activity and you
>were in your natural place of belief or religious experience and now,
>everything is expanding. Kundalini and Holy Spirit energies work
>together to bring you into Enlightenment. God Bless Both of You on your
>path. Gloria
I wonder how you see the inter-relatedness of these energies - Holy Spirit
and kundalini. As per an earlier post I am trying myself to resolve their
precise relationship (I am blessed/cursed with the desire to understand as
well as to experience). The best model that I have so far is that in
tantric Buddhism. The white bodhicitta (Holy Spirit?) descends from above
to meet the red bodhicitta/Candali (kundalini?) at the heart. This union is
also reflected in alchemical writings and to a lesser extent in Shaivite
Tantrism. The point of my earlier post on this topic - to which I haven't
discerned any response in the current deulge of postings - is that it is
very tempting to get completely focused on one of these ``currents'' or the
other. The Holy Spirit is very fulfilling and the rising kundalini is very
powerful and attractive - but only in their union is a fully mature
experience realized
Kurt
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 10:01:57 +0100
From: Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.com>
To: James Walters <jwaltersATnospamridgecrest.ca.us>
CC: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Introduction
Message-ID: <342F6E81.3B53ATnospamintercomm.com>
James Walters wrote:
>
> Hi Gloria,
> Wonderfull analogy...dance in the fire :).
> I'll check out your home page probably tomorrow.
> Thank you for the insight into the process.
> James
>
> >
> >Looking forward to knowing you. Gloria
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 09:57:39 +0100
From: Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.com>
To: madammumATnospamptialaska.net
CC: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com, rtrATnospammicron.net, AES3DDDATnospamaol.com,
geminiATnospampowernet.net
Subject: Re: ways of the heart
Message-ID: <342F6D7F.9BCATnospamintercomm.com>
vale v: so - you are saying that the planetary energies are
transmuting to
> >
> <snip>
> v: would you say that kundalini was akin to 'buddha nature' &/or wisdom,
> or is it not a mental process? sounds rather like bein electrocuted so
> far!
> <snip>
> > Gloria:
Kundalini is cosmic energy released inside the body. In fact Maha
kundalini is eternal cosmic energy and Kula Kundalini is individual
psychic energy. It is not a mental process like in thinking, but it is
transformation of the brain. In fact, the brain is totally remade
through kundalini. And the head feels very different when it is
illumanated 24 hours a day. If you were not use to it, it would be
difficult because it is nothing like a normal head. NOTHING! YET IT IS
WONDERFUL BUT DIFFERENT because there is so much going on inside the
head. In fact, at times I feel that I am nothing but a head with
kundalini working away in the brain. The rest of the body seems to be
here to carry the head, sounds strange but it is true.
> >
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 11:43:41 +0100
From: Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.com>
To: david.bozziATnospamsnet.net
CC: "Kundalini rtrATnospammicron.net AES3DDDATnospamaol.com rtrATnospammicron.net geminiATnospampowernet.net" <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Dream
Message-ID: <342F865D.54A5ATnospamintercomm.com>
David Bozzi wrote:
>
> Last night I dreamt I was in my room.
>
> I suddenly began to sense an attribute of "buoyancy" in my body.
>
> I walked over to the open second floor window.
>
> Inhaled the fresh stimulating air.
>
> I knew that I was dreaming.
>
> I leaped out the window and floated up.
>
> Past the power lines.
>
> Higher than the trees.
>
> As I began to drift higher I became fearful.
>
> I told myself,"Just relax. Let go. Trust."
>
> I drifted higher into the clouds.
>
> Higher and higher... until?
GG
Great dream David, I call this a consciousness dream because you were
not relating to being a body or needing equipment to get from point A to
point B. The other thing you told yourself to trust even though you
begin to let your mind come in. Still it was powerful in that knowing
was strong enough to take you out of your limitations.
>
> There was a powerful message here for me.
>
> Something I have heard many times.
>
> But on an experiential level where it is so clearly manifested
>
> is something different.
>
> Fear keeps us grounded and stagnant.
>
> But trust, the more we have the higher we go.
GG
Very true, all restrictions are self imposed, this dream shows you
exactly what grounds you, thought, fear, and yet, you know all you have
to do is let go and flow with spirit/soul awareness. The more you allow
yourself to move into this, the stronger your centering will become in
your day and less interference you will manifest here as well. This
shows you know but not quite enough to simply totally accept. Gloria
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 11:55:21 +0100
From: Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.com>
To: Kurt Keutzer <keutzerATnospamsynopsys.com>
CC: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Kundalini and Holy Spirit (was Pentecostal Kundalini)
Message-ID: <342F8918.6FD7ATnospamintercomm.com>
Kurt Keutzer wrote:
>
> Gloria in repsonce to Gordon and David (on Pentecostal Kundalini)
>
> > This is true, and what you describe is very accurate, but people even
> >in the not knowing what was happening were experiencing and opening up
> >to kundalini. Life is the teacher, and when this experience came to you
> >from outside, it also took you inside. The preacher no doubt doesn't
> >understand what the outcome of this is, it is just understood that the
> >Holy Spirit is working ...which it is. But, the deep inner understanding
> >hasn't come through. Now you see it was a step, and what it released
> >inside of you was awareness which made your spiritual walk ever more
> >powerful. Everything is used and has purpose.
> > Kundalini is the interior prana, divine energy, Holy Spirit drops down
> >while kundalini is coming up. That likely started the activity and you
> >were in your natural place of belief or religious experience and now,
> >everything is expanding. Kundalini and Holy Spirit energies work
> >together to bring you into Enlightenment. God Bless Both of You on your
> >path. Gloria
>
> I wonder how you see the inter-relatedness of these energies - Holy Spirit
> and kundalini. As per an earlier post I am trying myself to resolve their
> precise relationship (I am blessed/cursed with the desire to understand as
> well as to experience). The best model that I have so far is that in
> tantric Buddhism. The white bodhicitta (Holy Spirit?) descends from above
> to meet the red bodhicitta/Candali (kundalini?) at the heart. This union is
> also reflected in alchemical writings and to a lesser extent in Shaivite
> Tantrism. The point of my earlier post on this topic - to which I haven't
> discerned any response in the current deulge of postings - is that it is
> very tempting to get completely focused on one of these ``currents'' or the
> other. The Holy Spirit is very fulfilling and the rising kundalini is very
> powerful and attractive - but only in their union is a fully mature
> experience realized
>
> Kurt
Exactly so, I was just reading a book on Shakti Kundalini and for the
first time I found it explained in eastern thought. They do call the
comsic energy Maha Kundalini and the individual psychic energy Kula
Kundalini.
To our western consciousness, Holy Spirit would be the Maha Kundalini
and yes it does drop down just as you described and meets kundalini at
the heart. The thing is from my experience, kundalini is increasing the
body/mind frequency so that it will be able to hook up with the cosmic
which is much more powerful. I see it as the provider or tranformer of
the individual experience which includes the body, so that the clear
light of Godhead can manifest and finish the job.
I experience this through chakra's above the head actually three, when
the clear light, or Ain Sof in Jewish terms drops down. This connects
one into divine Will as the spiritual hierarchy works to assist
humanity. It is my experience that one actually becomes absorbed into it
so that it becomes consciousness of the whole. Gloria
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 12:18:56
From: ori^ <oriATnospameskimo.com>
To: Kundalini list <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Awakening and Kundalini
Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19970929121856.49277734ATnospammail.eskimo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Dear David,
What synchronicity that you have posted a question about the very
thing I've been thinking about for a week or so.
I've been toying with the idea that the activation of what is
referred to as kundalini might occur in different chakras or
different levels of the auric field. Thus one could be awakened
through the 5th or 6th chakra... but not yet in the 1st.
I've been waiting till I had time to formulate this more clearly...
but for now will just say it in this rough form.
At 23:45 9/29/97 -0000, David Tompkins wrote:
>There are many times when people speak of severe physical symptoms
>that I too have questioned whether I have experienced kundalini...
>Many more knowledgable than myself might make the division between
>kundalini and awakening... interested in hearing their comments...
>Yes, I do believe from an amateurs point of view that a gentle kundalini
>awakening is possible. Then again maybe I'm still at an early stage
>in the process.
For me, while it is clear I've been at home with the ideas presented
on this list for a long while, I too was wondering about the lack of
the physical sensations, UNTIL the last couple weeks when I started
taking a Kundalini Yoga class. I have taken the Kundalini Meditation
class since last March or so... but hadn't felt ready for the yoga
till recently.
For my process I am speculating that there was an awakening which
originally took place through the 5th (and/or 6th chakras). I have
worked hard for the last 10 years on moving from living exclusively
in a head realm of the intellect through lots and lots and lots of
deep emotional clearing, then through spiritual work, and finally
in the last 2 years, a phase of "Moving into the body."
For months now my energy has been high, I've not been sleeping much,
but it isn't insomnia. New ideas are coming to me at a fast and furious
pace, as if I'm reaching a new level of integration. Actually the last
couple weeks I've been thinking I need to find a way to bring it down a
notch... and so tools like backing off on meditation (but staying grounded),
eating a steak, using herbs, eating chocolate, have come in handy.
And now... with the yoga, some of the classic kundalini symptoms
are beginning to manifest. And it happened so quickly! But then
I've been preparing the ground for some time now. I'm finding that
both when I'm doing yoga and throughout the day I'm experiencing
spontaneous spinal undulations. I did talk with the yoga teacher who
explained it as the energy moving through and clearing blocks on an
energetic level. These undulations are something which I can allow...
or I can stop them if the time and place is not right.
For me I have a firm belief that this awakening process is something
that we participate in... and not something that takes us over and we
give up our power to. I see it as a co-creative process... and
perhaps I am fortunate to have had so much prep work which has given
me tools to learn how to work with it. I trust in the timing, and also
in the fact that I can request for it to slow down (if I so desire).
One good analogy the yoga teacher brought up was that just like on the
physical level when we are holding a yoga posture... there is a point
reached which to go beyond would cause strain to the body. We want to
be able to work at the edges, but not go into strain. The same is true
on the energetic level... working with the K-energy to take us to our
edges and beyond... but not going into strain.
And so... to echo David's statement... I too am interested in hearing
the views of others about kundalini and awakening...
I only know that some process has been activated for many years now,
and that it is not something I would choose to close down to.
I'm rather enjoying this journey.
In service to the process,
ori^
ori^
oriATnospameskimo.com
http://www.eskimo.com/~ori/ori.html
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 20:34:49 +0000
From: Bliss <readyATnospamdircon.co.uk>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Questions follow up
Message-ID: <3430104E.7668ATnospamdircon.co.uk>
Hi everyone
First of all thank you all so much for the varying comments received so
far in reply to my questions and 'predicament'.
It was interesting to read replies which suggest that my boyfriend is
not 'the one' for me... because I instinctively feel that he is... I was
in love with him for a year and a half before I met him, and ta bizarre,
whirling set of coincidences brought us closer and closer until...
POW!!!... we set our eyes on each other and that was it.
He is certainly not ashamed or guilt-ridden about sex, in fact he is
quite the opposite, and in our relationship we are completely free and
honest and open with each other... nudity features a lot(!), and any
problems, no matter how tiny, are worked over until resolved. It is I
who is the more secretive and 'closed off' one, requiring careful
'coaxing' from him to 'stop being so very independent.'
Perhaps my situation may be seen a new light if I tell you that I am 26
years old, and he is 18....? (!) He looks young for his age too, very
angelic... boyish... sulky, quiet, studious, very sensitive, loving,
prodigiously talented in music, definitely not a loud 'lad' type, and
extremely and genuinely intelligent and wise to boot. It would be true
to say that I am putty in his hands, but the reverse also applies... he
adores me, and we have had a very strong and intense relationship since
we met a year ago. This difference in spiritual experience/belief being
our only sticking point. He is very interested in religion, but
subscribes to no one particular strain, however he seems to lean towards
Christianity. He is definitely most cynical about Mystical religion,
however, labelling it 'the occult', and therefore something which
mustn't be touched.
Any further comments would be greatly appreciated..!
Thank you so much,
and love to you all.
Bliss x x
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