To: K-list
Recieved: 1999/06/04 23:19
Subject: Re: [K-list] Black Magic
From: jasmine five
On 1999/06/04 23:19, jasmine five posted thus to the K-list:
>From: Dharma <fisher1ATnospamstic.net>
>Reply-To: Dharma <fisher1ATnospamstic.net>
>To: kundaliniATnospamList-Server.net
>CC: martinATnospamtucana.demon.co.uk
>Subject: Re: [K-list] Black Magic
>Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 19:08:51 -0500
>
>Hi Jasmine,
>
> >> >It was my understanding that attempting to control other people is
>what
> >> >amounts to black magic, and controlling one's self, white.
> >>
> >>It is my understanding that power is neither black nor white, but it is
>the
> >>use of power for good or for evil purposes that makes the action white
>or
> >>black. We can define and clarify "good and evil" in various ways...
> >>positive and negative... other-serving and self-serving... helpful or
> >>harmful. But the point is that it is the purpose that makes the action
> >>black or white.
> >>
> >>I don't think we can see all attempts to control other people as always
> >>negative/bad/"black"... surgeons do it... psychiatrists do it...
> >>teachers... policemen... even traffic cops. :) As they are working
>for
> >>the good of others, their actions are "white."
>
> >>Dear Dharma; hope you don't mind me butting in here and forgive me if I
> >>have misunderstood your point,
>
>You don't seem to be disagreeing with me... just elaborating on the
>differences among peoples' motives and the complexities of the whole
>matter.
>
> >>but I would have thought that a medical
> >>operation would require the consent of the subject;
>
>Yes, some of the categories above require the consent of the individual,
>and some require the consent of the society.
>
>(These are just examples I threw in... pick some others if you like...)
>
>Offhand, I can't think when it would be proper to attempt to control
>another without consent... except when you witness sudden physical illness
>or accident... and you feel an imperative to do _something_ to try to save
>a life.
>
>Also, you may receive guidance that something is needed and that it is all
>right to give it. For instance, if you are walking through an emergency
>room and see a group of people grieving... and feel/hear guidance to give
>them peace... then give peace.
>
> >and you would have to
> >>be VERY clear about your own motives before interfering with another
> >>person's life...
>
>Always.
>
>Of course, it is easier to be clear about guidance when the matter does not
>involve you personally in any way... then you have no personal motives.
>
>...I would have my reservations on the motives of various
> >>individuals within the categories outlined above that I personally have
> >>come across, anyway!
>
>I suppose that's true of any group of people... people vary... if I trust
>one surgeon, that doesn't mean I trust them all. :)
>
> > And I have come across a few individuals who would
> >>describe themselves as 'magicians' or 'teachers' who have been rather
> >>confused about their own motives without seemingly realising it!
>
>That happens... that's why it's best to know ourselves as well as
>possible... and work through all the unconscious karmic stuff as
>thoroughly as possible, clearing it away... expand the area available to
>the conscious focus... be whole and healthy ourselves.
>
>Whatever is not conscious to us is unconscious... and can bite us when
>we're not looking... or bite someone else. :) Repression is a poor choice
>of how to handle ourselves, because if we repress something, it's still
>down in the unconscious and it can still bite!
>
>It is said that great power is available only to those who are trustworthy.
>Become trustworthy, and great power will be available.
>
>Harmlessness (ahimsa) and truth to all beings are keywords here. Become
>established in harmlessness to all, and none will harm you; harmony will
>surround you. Become established in truth to all, and... eventually...
>what you say will be so. When you no longer want power, great power will
>be available.
>
>Love,
>Dharma
>
>Dear Dharma; glad to see we are not in disagreement.
I particularly agree with you about repression and the fact that it is
easier if one is not personally involved in a situation ( even if that
involvement is just on the <subconscious> level of having unresolved
personal baggage or a need for power).
But yes, in principle I do believe we should offer assistance to those in
distress if we can, even if that assistance takes an apparently more mundane
form like a cup of tea or making someone laugh or even cry...
As for what is said about power; in things that occur on a certain level
that may well be true (my understanding on that is, I'm sure, like the whole
subject, rather weak- I do see the sense in what you say...) but my cynical
side raises it's hand here and asks about the power wielded by various in
positions of ultimate power- politically and professionally-
harmless?..trustworthy..? Tell that to the Kosovans and other similar pawns!
Where are the trustworthy and just who have enough power to make a real
difference in these situations and others similarly distressing;-other than
on a local level.
Sorry for sounding off here; it is not meant as a political rant; it's just
a rather simple point of philosophical order my thick head seems unable to
find a solution for...I see the application for what you have said often on
a more localised level and observe it in interpersonal relationships,
certainly, though.
:) Jasmine
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