kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 96 : Issue 161
1 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996
From: haakonuATNOSPAMtelepost.no (Haakon Rian Ueland)
Subject: Re: Intro and Outtro?
Hello again.
I got a mail asking me to make it clear what I meant with 75% of the mail
being off-topic. OK, here goes - this is from Kundalini-l digest #47:
Re: Traditional values or none?
Here we are treated with views on eating dogs, sacrificing animals and
humans, teenage mothers, A. Crowleys "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole
of the law" (which actually is modified by "Love is the law, love under
will" - I've done some weird reading...), Hitler, who was the second Anti-
Christ, the sword that pierced Jesu' side... 4 pages quoted, 1 page answer,
totally irrelevant.
-
Re: Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi
Good and relevant, but 3 pages quoted and 5 lines answered.
Re: Elephant fable
Good.
Re: Good and evil
What is this? This seems to have nothing to do with K.A. 2 pages quoted, 2
lines of greetings in answer.
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Re: Good and evil & Faith
2 pages quoted, 1/2 page answer, some fascinating viewpoints and a lovely
sentence:
"To get rid of the darkness, don't switch off the light, instead increase
the light until the darkness is no more." Thank you for this.
Re Re Good and evil
Good and interesting
Re: Good and evil
Halfway to the point.
Where to next?
Excellent question, Jan! Made me think - what has happened after my
awakening? Where would I've been without it?
Then some fascinating answers to the Where to next-question.
Looking over my reply, I see my "75% irrelevant" might've been to harsh -
but there is a lot of unnecessary quotes here - and some threads that are
starting to smell...
Granted, I was a bit grumpy - had a tough day - trying to be a
music-teacher for 7'th and 8'th-graders does things to your mood - but
still, what I wrote was something I've felt since I subscribed.
Remember, some things ought to be discussed over private e-mail.
-
To round off - in my opinion, mental "illness" and Kundalini are closely
related, quite simply because our Western medical system doesn't understand
what a Kundalini Awakening can do to a person. So, here's a poem I wrote,
both to myself but mostly to some people who were going through a real
tough time. Comments are very welcome, both positive and negative.
The black light of depression
by Haakon Rian Ueland
If I only could take your pain,
your depressions, neuroses, psychosis and your anxiety
Wrap them nicely in rosepetals and swallow them
To give you a vacation
A small break
I would have
If I only could seize
your sorrow over things done and undone
your angst for living and for dying
your anger over lost chances
for a short while
I would have
But I can't
I can reach you a hand
now and then, a tiny word at times
But you have to live with your pain
It is a part of you
Without it you
aren't you
Doesn't the flowers of love light up much stronger in front of a
wallcarpet of sorrow?
Doesn't the bright summerdays shine brighter after
dark winterdays?
Doesn't happiness shine like a nova in
the black light of depression?
[Translating poetry is harder than I thought...:-)]
Be well,
Haakon
--
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(. .)
*----------------------------ooO-(_)-Ooo------------------------------*
I Haakon Rian Ueland haakonuATNOSPAMtelepost.no I
I Kundalini Homepage: http://aloha.net/~bpeay/kundalini/xindex.html I
I The day I can call myself a writer is the day - I can call myself I
I
a writer... I
I I
I Address: Riihimakivn. 15, N-2013 SKJETTEN, Norway I
I I
I Namaste - Sanskrit, "The divine in me greets the divine in you." I
*---------------------------------------------------------------------*
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.
2 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996
From: traveler
Subject: Re: Intro and outtro?
Thanks, that was very well done.
I see zillions of connections of kundalini to other things, certainly enough
to not have to wander off topic for lots of years.
I make a point of using the word kundalini in every post I send. That is my
way of honoring the list and everyone who is on it.
-
Best, Patti
3 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996
From: Dan Gahlinger
Subject: Re: Intro and outtro?
My 2c worth on this whole thread... this is not meant as a flame against
any person or persons, neither is expressed or implied...
First of all, perhaps there are posts that are non-kundalini related, and
you started to notice this when you tried to point them out, that there
arent that many off-topic. But...
I dont think everyone on this list really knows what "kundalini" is, or for
that matter, I'm not sure anyone really does. But those who are just
starting into the process, or think they might be dont know much if
anything about it, they dont know what is kundalini-related, and what isnt.
-
this gets worse for those who have never heard of kundalini before, are
going through weird and/or rough times and have somehow made their way to
this list, and probably still dont know what the word means.
and then there are those who are going through the process, or think they
might be, know a little bit about it, but not much, and are just skittish
enough that they are not confident enough to post. this is larger because
of the lack of acceptance of such discussions. and with the recent
excessively-religious posts, I don't blame them for not speaking out.
-
and of course, there are various mixtures of the above, and so forth.
the above groups probably comprises most of the lurkers. but thats a guess,
and i dont know what percentage they might make up, but it's probably
reasonably large.
my point is, these people are looking for guidance, and are probably afraid
to post, and chasing after them with a stick to "stay on topic" when they
dont even know what the topic is, is a bit much I think.
-
I agree that excessive posts off-topic (eg: preachy ones, as recent),
should be eliminated. but let's not get overly-miltant about it.
such posturing only kills a list. I've seen this happen before. this exact
same policy was implemented on another list I used to be part of. as soon
as they adopted these like policies, the list died. literally. and it didnt
take long either. within a week everyone had left. by everyone i mean those
posting, most of the lurkers, and the ones making any difference, ie:
without them there was no point to having the list. what's the point of
having a list if you are going to "strong-arm" people into complying with
rules, that only end up hurting the list?
its kind of funny, ironic in a way, that other list went to a strict
"on-topic" only, no personal stuff, or off-topic in any posts. it was
strictly enforced. people breaching it were kicked off or pressured to
leave. the ironic part was that the list actually got more preachy, and
those enforcing the rules weren't even keeping on-topic. but at that point
the "topic" was purely up to those enforcing the rules.
I'd rather not see that happen here. i'd suggest a relatively balaced
approach to things.
if people are posting too much off-topic, inform them, but I also wont
tolerate elitist attitudes, that means, all parties must be informed. if 3
different people go off-topic, inform all 3, not just 1 because someone
complains, especially if that person is also off-topic.
newbies need to be given special handling, so that they feel welcome and
comfortable with posting here, we should extend to them to write a message,
about whatever they like as to whatever they are going through, or leaving
a questionable first post to Richard.
that way they get into the habit of posting, aren't frightened off by the
veterans, and i think they'd be surprised at how much they're going through
is common to so many people, which only serves to make them feel more
comfortable.
well, thats the end of my preaching, again i did not mean this to be harsh,
or directed at any person, persons, or whatever. just my opinion, for
whatever it's worth.
Dan.
There are always possibilities...
4 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: davelong
Subject: De Kundalinii
** De Kundalinii **
Within the spinal chord resides a central-most nerve.
It extends from the base of the spine up into the brain.
Science has not found any reason yet why this nerve exists.
It is the Pathway to Brahman.
Orthodox Christians will bless themselves by making the
Sign of the Cross. They will touch their foreheads, and
say: "Father." Then they touch their hearts, and say: "Son."
Then they touch each of their shoulders, and say: "Holy Spirit."
They are touching their chakras (shoulders being at the same
level as throats). [Religion is the institutionalization
of divine wisdom, imparted by God to men and women who were
close to Him.]
The soul is said to reside in the spine. As it rises, each
higher center brings greater fulfilment to the soul.
The heart chakra (4th) is where divine love is found. It is the
opening of the higher centers. A warmth is experienced in the
heart area of the spine.
The throat chakra (5th) is where intuitive knowledge of God
is found. It is ecstatic, a place where the soul becomes most
fluid, and can separate from the body. There are a myriad of
facets to the 5th chakra, a plethora of lights and colors,
and exhilerating vistas and insights. Prophesy comes from
this center. Anyone immensely entranced with this level will
never go beyond its infinite traps. Powers come to one in the
5th chakra, and if these powers are not treated as "excrement,"
one will never go beyond. It is the Power of God, the Holy Spirit,
Maya, Shakti. Only the pure in heart will go beyond, where the
vision of God is attained.
The 5th chakra culminates in a total black chaos of great power.
It is the vision of Kali, the power of God. "God and His power are
one. You cannot think of milk without also thinking of its
whiteness, a gem and its lustre, fire and its power to burn." (1)
All the chakras below the 6th are "fluttery," and something amazing
occurs to the soul between the 5th and 6th chakras.
[Illumination, Ecstasy:]
The 6th chakra is where God is seen, directly with the soul.
"I have seen God more clearly than you are seeing me now. This
is because you are seeing me with your sense-organ of sight,
but when one sees God, it is directly with the soul" (1)
The Christian saints have called this chakra: "ecstasy."
It is a place of extreme and absolute duality. There is only
the soul and God, with a thin veneer of ego separating the two.
The vision of God imparts instant bliss. It can also destroy
the body of an impure soul. God has no desire to destroy, so the
soul which is not yet pure enough to sustain the vision of God
is sent back.
One must surrender everything to arrive at the 6th chakra.
When one comes back from the vision of God, there are more and
bigger things which will eventually also have to be surrendered.
"He who wishes to save his life shall lose it, while he who loses
his life for My sake shall find it." (2)
What are the signs of God-vision? They are:
1. One appears as a madman. One laughs and weeps, dances and sings.
2. One appears as a child, guiless and pure.
3. One appears as a ghoul, regarding clean and unclean alike.
After many such "savikalpa samadhis" [samadhi with modification]
the soul becomes pure enough to sustain the direct vision of God.
It has been described as "seeing a light in a lantern. You want to
embrace the light, but can't, because of the glass separating you
from it." (1)
[Enlightenment, Union:]
Eventually, the longing to embrace the light becomes so intense,
the soul is brought up to the final, 7th level in "nirvikalpa
samadhi" [samadhi without modification]. For mortals, there is no
coming back from the 7th chakra. The body is said to drop away
after 21 days. The last remnant of ego has been eliminated, and
Union with God is attained. Only avatars can return from the 7th
chakra, to found religions and reestablish righteousness.
The 6th chakra is like a bowman, aiming for the target. He strikes
the target, but the arrow drops out. The 7th chakra is where the
arrow hits the target, and it stays there.
There will always be a slight difference between the created
soul, and the Creator. The created soul is never equal to God.
(1) Sri Ramakrishna
(2) Jesus Christ
5 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: redormanATNOSPAMplix.com (Dorman, Robert )
Subject: Re: De Kundalinii
>** De Kundalinii **
->
>Within the spinal chord resides a central-most nerve.
>It extends from the base of the spine up into the brain.
......
THANKYOU! That was beautiful, even if it was a little long.
Very instructive, I think.
--Bob
A truly wise man will not be carried away by any of the eight winds:
prosperity, decline, disgrace, honor, praise, censure, suffering and
pleasure. He is neither elated by prosperity nor grieved by decline.
- ---Nichiren Daishonin
6 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: GREG KERNAGHAN
Subject: Kundalini...
THESE PAGES HAVE BECOME DILUTED.
CAN SOMEBODY ADDRESS THE TECHNIQUES AND PROCESSES INVOLVED IN KUNDALINI
YOGA, SO THE VALUE OF OUR UNION CAN BE BROADCAST TO THOSE WHO NEED IT
MOST?
HOW ABOUT A DISCUSSION OF THE MOST EFFECTIVE STRATEGIES FOR AWAKENING,
INSTEAD OF A PROTRACTED TREATISE ON THE SOCIO-MORAL ELEMENTS OF
KUNDALINI?
GREG KERNAGHAN
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7 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996
From: Paco
Subject: Re: Intro and Outtro?
Regarding the subject of staying on the "subject",
My feeling on this matter is that anyone who is
on the list is on the list because they connect
with it somehow, because they want to connect with
it...so of course they should say exactly what they
want to if that is their choice...I don't think that
we are so computerized that the list is just a queue
for us drones to upload raw data regarding the list
subject, so that interested parties can conveniently
download it...buy a book, it's easier on the eyes.
What fascinates me about this list is that there are
people in good states and good meditators on the list,
hey, if they want to talk about sports or movies, I
think it's good...I need good cyber-friends like that,
definitely.
That's just my opinion...I think the list is in the
context that people here love and worship Shri Kundalini
...so...it's all good.
---Paco
-
8 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: John Danu
Subject: AutoPost from Kundalini Resource Center
Dear Friends,
Actually I have several question concerning Kundalini :
1. I read somewhere that by moderating the sexual activity and
- moderating work, then , kundalini will be able to be awakened.
2. Is sexual activity is by means of the ejaculation ( for male ) ?
Because according to Tao Te Ching, As long as one does not ejaculate,
one can have sexual activities as many as he wants.
Thank you for any answer that may response to my questions.
-
9 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
Subject: Shri Devi & breezes
I have looked at Shri Devi's web page and tried her experiment of looking at
her picture and seeing if a cool breeze was felt in the palms and the head.
I indeed felt a cool breeze swirling in my right palm, but nothing in my
left. When I attempting to feel for the breeze at the head chakra, I felt
it with the right hand but not the left. What could be the reason to feel a
"kundalini breeze" in the right hand but not the left? Has anyone else
tried this or something similar?
Thanks for whatever information you can provide.
In Service to the Light,
-
10 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: NannuATNOSPAMsanctum.com
Subject: Dan*s possibilities...
I have to agree 100% with Dan, AND I must add a little note here.
I would love to go into detail as to my experience with K, because I
need feedback, but it is extremely sexual, and What little I have put
up on the board about it has either been totally ignored, or attacked. I
have therefore backed off.
If anyone would RESEARCH K, they would find that the sexual aspect
of K is everywhere and an important part of K. I believe many people
will not post because they feel, as I do, that it will not be accepted
because of it*s sexual nature.
A little food for thought...
--
CHILDREN of the UNIVERSE, ...Nannu
-
11 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 96
From: Richard Satin
Subject: Fwd: AutoPost from Kundalini Resource Center
------- FORWARD, Original message follows -------
Date: Wednesday, 25-Sep-96 12:52 AM
-
From: John Danu \ Internet: (djonoATNOSPAMrad.net.id)
To: Kundalini-L List \ Internet: (kundalini-lATNOSPAMexecpc.com)
Subject: AutoPost from Kundalini Resource Center
Dear Friends,
Actually I have several question concerning Kundalini :
1. I read somewhere that by moderating the sexual activity and
moderating work, then , kundalini will be able to be awakened.
2. Is sexual activity is by means of the ejaculation ( for male ) ?
Because according to Tao Te Ching, As long as one does not ejaculate,
one can have sexual activities as many as he wants.
Thank you for any answer that may response to my questions.
-
------- FORWARD, End of original message -------
--
The need for change bulldozed a road down the center of my mind.
Maya Angelou
-
12 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: "Michael J. Davis"
Subject: Re: Dan*s possibilities...
At 09:40 AM 9/25/96 +0000, NannuATNOSPAMsanctum.com wrote:
>I have to agree 100% with Dan, AND I must add a little note here.
>
>I would love to go into detail as to my experience with K, because I
>need feedback, but it is extremely sexual, and What little I have put
>up on the board about it has either been totally ignored, or attacked. I
>have therefore backed off.
>
I, for one, would like to hear more on your experiences.
>If anyone would RESEARCH K, they would find that the sexual aspect
>of K is everywhere and an important part of K. I believe many people
>will not post because they feel, as I do, that it will not be accepted
>because of it*s sexual nature.
>
A very true statement...in the Chinese concept of chi or intrinsic energy,
sex plays a very large role. The "seat of power" or dan tien is located in
that region. The higher levels of chi kung of energy work have a great deal
to do with regulating your sex life and jing or original essence.
Please don't let those that have not yet come to the full realization of
what opening the energy gates in the body really mean and has to do with get
you down.
Michael
*******************************
Michael J. Davis
Independent Network Consultant
mjdavisATNOSPAMcompassnet.com
PGP Public Key Available Upon Request
----------------------------------------------------------------
"It should be known that the secret principles of Gojuj-ryu
exist in the kata."
- Chojun Miyagi Sensei
Founder of Okinawan Goju-ryu Karate-do
13 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
Subject: Re: Dan*s possibilities...
At 09:40 AM 9/25/96 +0000, Nannu wrote:
>I would love to go into detail as to my experience with K, because I
>need feedback, but it is extremely sexual, and What little I have put
>up on the board about it has either been totally ignored, or attacked.
>
>If anyone would RESEARCH K, they would find that the sexual aspect
>of K is everywhere and an important part of K.
I would welcome stories of k awakening and experiences of all natures. I
would suggest that if some people are unconfortable with certain aspects of
kundalini, that they must look inside themselves to find the reasons for this.
As I am just starting the k process, I am interested in learing as much as
possible. As long as the sexual aspects are described with respect to
kundalini and not purely for shock or pornographic values, I don't think
many would object to hearing those stories.
In Service to the Light,
14 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: traveler
Subject: Re: Dan*s possibilities...
At 09:40 AM 9/25/96 +0000, you wrote:
>I have to agree 100% with Dan, AND I must add a little note here.
->
>I would love to go into detail as to my experience with K, because I
>need feedback, but it is extremely sexual, and What little I have put
>up on the board about it has either been totally ignored, or attacked. I
>have therefore backed off.
>
>If anyone would RESEARCH K, they would find that the sexual aspect
>of K is everywhere and an important part of K. I believe many people
>will not post because they feel, as I do, that it will not be accepted
>because of it*s sexual nature.
->
I agree totally.....
How about people who want to discuss this inidicate so and we can form an
off-topic group? Or, we can at least count the number of people who are
being shut out of this topic. Or take a vote, or ?????
Best, Patti
-
15 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: "Rondi McBoyer"
Subject: Re: Intro and outtro?
Dan,
Thank you for a well thought out and reasonably voiced message, I agree
with every point you made. Your point about people looking for guidance,
and being scared off by threats is well made and I'm sure appreciated by
alot of lurkers, and me.
Thanks, Rondi
16 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: Royale Jills
Subject: Re: De Kundalinii
Not bad Dave. Royale
-
17 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: Royale Jills
Subject: Re: Dan*s possibilities...
I 2ond that Gee, there are so many new people on the list now
I feel like Im starting all over again. Where are the oldies but
goodies? Mabe it would be a good idea to restate our initial
descriptions of our K. experiences? Royale
18 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: Royale Jills
Subject: Re: Dan*s possibilities...
Nannu. Yes K. has a sexual side just as you do, but certainly not ONLY
a sexual nature.I have found that while hoping for K. enlightenment I
was made aware of the sexual aspects there, but can pretty much ignore
or overlook those things if favor of a more spiritual reward. Royale
19 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: Royale Jills
Subject: Re: Increased Righteousness
No, but Ive noticed increased irritability since using the computer.
Royale
20 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: haakonuATNOSPAMtelepost.no (Haakon Rian Ueland)
Subject: Re: kundalini-food?
Paco wrote:
>I was wondering, does anybody know any really good
>recipes that are conducive to meditation?
Hello Paco
I don't know if this'll be any help, but prior to my own K-A I followed a
diet supposed to help with hypogluceamia. Lots of fresh vegetables and
fruit, two eggs every morning, no bread, lots of light meat, no
carbohydrates at all, no milk or milk-products, much water, absolutely no
refined sugar or substitutes. 6 small meals every day.
-
I don't know if this would help you. I know I felt better than I've done
ever. To bad it's too expensive to stay on with such a diet. BTW - a pure
macrobiotic diet should be pretty good as well.
Another thing: if any of you enjoyed my poem and would like to share it
with others - please do! But - keep my signature at the end of it. TIA
Love,
Haakon
--
\|||/
(. .)
*----------------------------ooO-(_)-Ooo------------------------------*
I Haakon Rian Ueland haakonuATNOSPAMtelepost.no I
I Kundalini Homepage: http://aloha.net/~bpeay/kundalini/xindex.html I
I The day I can call myself a writer is the day - I can call myself I
I a writer... I
I I
I Address: Riihimakivn. 15, N-2013 SKJETTEN, Norway I
I I
I Namaste - Sanskrit, "The divine in me greets the divine in you." I
*---------------------------------------------------------------------*
.
21 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 96
From: Richard Satin
Subject: Fwd: AutoPost from Kundalini Resource Center
------- FORWARD, Original message follows -------
Date: Wednesday, 25-Sep-96 12:52 PM
From: ia thunberg \ Internet:
(ia.thunbergATNOSPAMhalmstad.mail.telia.com)
To: Kundalini-L List \ Internet: (kundalini-lATNOSPAMexecpc.com)
Subject: AutoPost from Kundalini Resource Center
hello. I have been going through this hell for three years,can anybody help
me ease the pain?
Thank you.
------- FORWARD, End of original message -------
--
If a man like Malcolm X could change and repudiate racism, if
I myself and other former Muslims can change, if young whites can
change, then there is hope for America.
Eldridge Cleaver
22 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996
From: traveler
Subject: Re: Dan*s possibilities...
>As I am just starting the k process, I am interested in learing as much as
>possible. As long as the sexual aspects are described with respect to
>kundalini and not purely for shock or pornographic values, I don't think
>many would object to hearing those stories.
There is history here,
A while ago we had someone on who talked about sex probably more open than
most of us would feel comfortable with. He mentioned desires for pedophelia,
etc. He seemed legitimate, ie not a real pervert, just openly revealing how
the k had affected him.
Then we had people flaming everyone in the group, and some individuals, even
if they just talked about their own sexual situations. One very sweet man
was so offended that he left altogether, and we felt sad, because he seemed
to be very beautiful and real and hurt by the attacks.
Some screaming fights ensued. I for one took a stand for free speech only to
get flamed and accused of things that I myself have never discussed and have
no interest.
You can see how there are fundamentalists on this list. They can be the most
intolerant, judgemental people around. And they are out to make sure the
entire world agrees with them! THey often are most in favor of limiting free
speech to just what they think everyone should talk about.
So I am concerned, lest people who are legitimate are subjected to similar
treatment.
Yes, sex and k are strongly connected. This is why I thought that in order
to protect those of us who don't like flames we should go to a private chat
room. This is not a free internet, whether we like to think it is or not.
-
BY the way, Internet Explorer has netmeeting, a great chat room
facilty...Any other suggestions?
Best, Patti