kundalini-l-d Digest				Volume 96 : Issue 111 

Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: tejkohliATNOSPAMgiasdl01.vsnl.net.in
Subject: The Guru Thing

Hi Karol Ann! (Sorry, this one is longish)

At 02:51 PM 8/21/96 -0700, you wrote:
>I used to feel exactly the same way, making judgments against people 
>who charge a fee for a service.  I don't think that way anymore.
>Money is condensed energy, a feedback mechanism that tells me how well I 
>am succeeding in my reality.  It speaks to abundance and to love (not 
>self-indulgent love) but self-nurturing love of comfort and security in a 
>physical world.  Like the Money Tree that is in essence, the gifts of the 
>Goddess who loves us without condition and never has wanted us to be 
>without anything that brings us joy.  Yes, there is the danger of 
>becoming trapped in the physical manifestations, but that is what this 
>world is all about -- overcoming the traps.  There is no nobility in 
>poverty anymore, unless one chooses to live the austere life for their 
>growth.  But it is not a mandate that we have to deny ourselves in order 
>to be spiritual -- at least, not for me.  I guess we each have to make 
>that choice.  Karol Ann

With due respect to you, I disagree with the notion that it is OK to ask 
money in return for "spiritual favours" or "spiritual gifts". Actually I 
am totally against pedalling any spiritual stuff. I am glad that you have 
made the above point, because I can say the following about the way I 
feel about it.

Is not "spirituality" a lot like "love"? In fact is not true and pristine 
spirituality only about LOVE (and for me that includes sex whereever 
applicable). The essence of spiriuality is love. So by your reasoning, it 
should be OK to charge for giving love, any kind of love!

What would be the scenario in that case? You would start expecting money 
for loving. Then for loving a person, would you not get hooked to 
receiving money for it? Would that scene be the same as love without money?
-
Is not the same true of spirituality, which is another expression of 
love. Love for any human being, love for the SELF, love for existence.

If commercial gains become involved in it, then it becomes commercial 
organization. All commercial organisations, by their very nature, seek to 
maximise their gains. There is a tendency to create a need in the 
consumer. It may want you to depend upon it for spirituality, since it 
depends upon you for survival. That is their nature. I would like to add 
that I have nothing against commercial organisations. AS a matter of 
fact, I like them. They are always true to their nature. They typically 
have no notions of puerile purity. They are not hypocritical. They know 
what they want, and they openly go for it. They are in tune with our 
needs and instincts better sometimes than we are. I actually feel that 
being involved with any commercial organisation is great for one's 
spiritual growth. They ground you and make you real and earthy - the 
roots. However, lets leave out commercial organisations in the sector of 
spirituality. They will only tell you "You don't need to learn to walk on 
your own. It is too much pain and effort. Why don't you use our latest 
model in comfort crutches. They are made of aluminum, for lightness and 
strength. Plus they have a nice padding to absorb impacts.... all with 
three years warranty."

The second category are those spiritual organisations or individuals 
who dont ask for money etc. Ostensibly they are there to help you and ask 
nothing in return. But is that really true? Do they really ask nothing in 
return, or is it just a front? Are they not living off disciples 
contributions? Well, therein lies the problem A spiritual organisation or 
individual that survives on the basis of disciples will subtely come to 
depend upon the very disciples that it seeks to help. If it depends upon 
them, then it will want to hang onto them. That is the nature of things. 
Then it will like the disciples to depend upon it. And thats the end of 
that story for many.

There is however, a third category of individuals, like the master in the 
Himalayas as described in the Swami Ramas book "Living with the Himalayan 
Masters", who lives aloof, who has to be sought out, who wants nothing in 
return, and who has a lot of wisdom to partake of. It was in reference to 
this kind of guru that I had posted earlier.  I would say that even with 
this kind of guru or master, one should be careful and examine. This kind 
of a master can be very seductive to persons on the spiritual path. 
However, he/she can help in one of two ways - either by words of wisdom, 
or by some supernatural intervention of energy. The words are there, 
anywhere and everywhere, for one to pick from - one has to be open only. The 
universe, the existence will send the right message. As for as supernatural 
intervention of energy is concerned - there can be none more powerful 
than the energy itself, and it resides within- watching everything, and 
it is not a dud, inert thing!

Peace and LOve,
Tej



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Pat Welsh 
Subject: Mudras (YJ excerpts, Part 2)

THE *PRANA NADI* MUDRAS

"The *prana nadi* mudras are technically energetic mudras (*prana* = life
force, *nadi* = channels) that work with the breath.  They channel breath
and prana into the lungs and torso in particular configurations..."

6. *Kanishta Prana Nadi* Mudra (activates the lower abdomen and back and the
lower lobes of the lungs): "The tips of the thumbs and forefingers form a
circle.  Keep other fingers completely straight."

7. *Madhyama Prana Nadi* Mudra (Activates the middle chest and back and the
middle lobes of the lungs): "With the tip of the thumbs and forefingers
touching, fold tips of remaining fingers into center of palm."

8. *Jyeshtha Prana Nadi* Mudra (activates the upper chest and back and the
upper lobes of the lungs): "Place thumbs in middle of palms, wrap fingers
around thumbs.  Place hands face down."

9. *Poorna Prana Nadi* Mudra (activates the entire torso, front and back,
and the upper, middle, and lower lobes of the lungs): "Middle finger
knuckles touch together and back of hands turn downward toard floor."

-




Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Pat Welsh 
Subject: Mudras (YJ excerpts, Part 3)

THE *MERUDANDA* MUDRAS
-
"The *merudanda* mudras are also energetic mudras (*meru* = Mount Meru, the
spine; *danda* = staff), but their use brings prana into deeper regions of
the central nervous system.  They do not so much channel the actual
breath--like the *sharira* and the *prana nadi* mudras--as they do the life
force itself..."

10. *Adho Merudanda* Mudra (energy comes into the base and lower third of
the spinal column, nervous system, and chakras): "Curl fingertips into
palms, extend thumbs out straight--do not let them bend."
-
11. *Merudanda* Mudra (energy comes into the middle third of the spinal
column, nervous system, and chakras) "Outer edge of palms and little fingers
rest on thighs.  Thumbs remain straight and extended."

12. *Urdhva Merudanda* Mudra (activates the upper third of the spinal
column, nervous system, and chakras): "With backs of the hands resting on
the thighs, thumbs face outward, pointing away from each other."


-


Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Mary Knapp 
Subject: Re: recovering

At 11:47 AM 8/23/96 -0400, Arlene Benjamin wrote:

>Dan: Are you feeling much better now? Hope so! And everyone else who has
>been feeling ill.
>
>Love and Light to all,
>Namaste'...Arlene
>Peace begins at home*

I can swallow and talk without pain now.  I go back to work on Monday after
a few months off.  At this point I would rather be working and feeling well
than at home feeling sick with my energy depleted.  The best thing about K
for me has been the energy.  I miss going full speed 16 hours a day and
expect to again soon.  Thanks for all the loving thoughts.  I hope
*everyone* is perking up.

Mary



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: tejkohliATNOSPAMgiasdl01.vsnl.net.in
Subject: JC
-
Hi Maimu,

	Thank you for that heart. It was beautiful and it picked me up 
after I felt down with the JC bullshit!

Hi Student,

	I feel for you. As Von said, you are yourself not aware of whst 
you are saying. You have no experience or clear thinking to help you in 
this hour. It seems even JC has failed you. You feel lost and sad and 
forlorn, in pain and depressed. I would suggest that you hang on to this 
list. It will help you. But PLEASE ... just lurk and post for a while.

Peace and Love,
Tej



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Dan Gahlinger 
Subject: Re: Maimu

At 11:47 AM 8/23/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Dan: Are you feeling much better now? Hope so! And everyone else who has
>been feeling ill.
>
thanks Arlene. not quite, but getting there, slowly. sigh...
btw: never noticed your email address until now, its rather nice...

Dan.
Dan.
there are always possibilities...



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Dan Gahlinger 
Subject: messages

Uhm, nothing personal. but could we try to avoid quoting a rather long
message and just putting in a one-line reply? eeek... sorry it took me a
while to find if there was a message at the end...

Dan.
Dan.
there are always possibilities...



-
Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Pat Welsh 
Subject: Mudras (YJ excerpts, Part 4/end)

THE *PRANA KRIYA* MUDRAS

	"Each mudra contains...a practical application and an esoteric symbology.
The symbolic representation hidden within the *prana kriya* mudras is a
wonderful example of an open secret waiting to be revealed.  In this
mudra--also called *jnana* mudra, the "gesture of wisdom"--fire combines
with air as we touch together the thumb and the index finger.  The other
fingers are held out extended and straight.  The hands rest on the thighs or
knees with palms turned upward.  The thumb represents the Universal Self;
index finger the individual self; middle finger the ego; ring finger, maya,
the illusory world; and the little finger, worldly actions and reactions.
It is said (act this out with your hand as you read the following words) as
the individual self (forefinger) reaches up to seek the Universal Self
(thumb), moving away from involvement with ego (middle finger), maya (ring
finger), and worldly reactions (little finger), the Universal Self reaches
down with grace, and, showing Itself as Itself, takes the individual self
into Itself.
	"The *prana kriya* mudras are energetic mudras (*prana* = life force,
*kriya* = cleansing) used to induce a progressively deepening, open, and
alert meditative awareness.  Like the last two mudra sets, they do not so
much channel the actual breath as they do the life force itself..."

13. *Shraddha Prana Kriya* Mudra (eases respiration, increases the flow of
blood to the brain centers, and opens one into meditation.  Also increases
memory retention and relieves insomnia): "The very tips of thumbs and
forefingers meet.  Do not allow them to collapse during mudra."

14. *Medha Prana Kriya* Mudra (slows respiration, increases the flow of
blood to the brain, brings attention into the brain centers, activates the
discriminative centers of higher wisdom in the brain, and opens one into
meditation): "Tips of forefingers touch middle joint of thumbs at the line
of the first crease.  Palms face upward, resting on knees."

15. *Prajna Prana Kriya* Mudra (slows respiration, increases the flow of
blood to the brain, brings attention into the brain centers, and opens one
into meditation.  Witness consciousness unfolds): "Tips of forefingers touch
first joint atbase of thumbs.  Keep thumbs and three fingers fully extended."

note: these mudra descriptions were taken from the article's photo-caption
areas, as the text area seemed unnecessarily long

end



-
Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: Re: JC

On Thu, 22 Aug 1996, John Carlson wrote:

> > 7)  A message I sent to another list is being "held" because the list limit
> > has been exceeded.  In two years on lists I've never had that happen before.
> 
> Actually, I've had it happen on a list that I run at least a couple of
> times this year (usually during the weekend, of course!)
> 
> John
> 

How many people named "John" are on this list?  There are at least three.

Mac ( John )

- ;*)

> 



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: tejkohliATNOSPAMgiasdl01.vsnl.net.in
Subject: Re JC

Hi Student,

 I had said:

>	I feel for you. As Von said, you are yourself not aware of whst 
>you are saying. You have no experience or clear thinking to help you in 
>this hour. It seems even JC has failed you. You feel lost and sad and 
>forlorn, in pain and depressed. I would suggest that you hang on to this 
>list. It will help you. But PLEASE ... just lurk and post for a while.

>Peace and Love,
>Tej

The last line was a mistype. I meant to write :

PLEASE ... just lurk and DONT post for a while. Thanks.

Peace and Love,
Tej

-

Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: Re: JC

> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>     When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandfather......
>      Not screaming and crying like the passengers in his car did.
-

Yes, me too.

Mac.



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: re: hair

On Fri, 23 Aug 1996 hbarrettATNOSPAMix.netcom.com wrote:

> The woman who cuts my hair (knows nothing of me and K) says my hair is 
> growing in more thick and wavy.  This overjoys me because I'd been 
> certain I was going to end up one of those balding elderly ladies who 
> buys peculiar things at the supermarket!  Now, at least, I don't think 
> I'll be bald ;-)
> 
> Holly
> 

Has yoga increased your health? Are you eating better?

Mac
  



-
Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Karol Ann Barnett 
Subject: Re: JC

Said Caliban to Merlin,

"If you want the gods to go with you, 
you must put yourself in their way."

-

Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: tejkohliATNOSPAMgiasdl01.vsnl.net.in
Subject: The Guru Thing

Hi Karol,

	Thanks for your message. I truly understand your viewpoint. I 
think you misunderstood me on the aspect of money. I DO NOT consider 
money to be bad or evil. To me money is very very spiritual.

	What I was refering to was that a spiritual organisation, when it 
becomes commercial, starts to depend upon its disciples, and then seeks 
to defend its position. The case that you have described is very 
interesting and of a different variety. It is different because Jach is 
not claiming to be something that is essential in your life.

	What kind of channeling does he do? In what way has it helped 
you? I would like to know.
-
Love,
Tej



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: hbarrettATNOSPAMix.netcom.com (Holly N. Barrett, Ph.D.)
Subject: re: hair

Mac -- I've always taken pretty good care of myself and stayed healthy, 
but it is certainly true that the Energy accelerates good intentions 
already present.

  My hairdresser started making the remarks after K broke through in a 
major way.  Now it seems so circular, I don't know what causes what!

Holly


-
Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: V487ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: Dark side invasion

Hi: Dan

>these are the times of darkness, and sadness, and it seems grief as well.<

Yes and no.  In my opinion it is just energy.  You can use it to cure cancer
or in the electric chair. Negative and positive at the same time.   When you
see darkness, sadness, and grief you will also see souls waking up and trying
to make the change for the better.  At this time we all have the energy to
evolve or self-destruct.  We are the only thing on this earth that has a will
for better or worse.  Do you know why we have a will and nothing else does?

>like the one who was my friend for so many years, believes he is pure of
ethics, but cannot see beyond his own ego, who threw away his long-term
marriage for "the magic" (as I sometimes like to call it now). he who has
been consumed by ego, and attacks what (those who) he fears, or does not
understand (and therefore fears). he has embraced the darkness, but he
cannot see it, he is blinded by the greed for things he cannot have or do.
things he will probably never accomplish, because of the choices he has
made. for him, it is too late, there is no longer time to revert to
goodness.<

You are one of the lucky ones.  All the people will evolve in their own
speed.  Every thing in this universe will sooner or later evolve.  Some
people walk and some people take the airplane.  Just like song. "I don't care
how you get here just get here as fast as you can".   Every thing is perfect.
- As I said so many times.  We are here in this special place and time because
that is exactly were we belong in our own evolution. In fact we cannot see
anything else because we have not reached that level yet.  We see only what
corresponds to our own evolution. If you want to see more then you have to
evolve more.  Nothing changes except your own perspective of it.   I love
"Ram Dass"  when he says every thing is just perfect.<

circumstance, and there is still a glimmer of white within him, but I am
afraid the darkness has him too.<

Don't worry about these people.  Just give them your support and love.  If
they are not ready then you can talk your head off and they would not
understand. 

For a person that is aware and enlightened.  Every single leaf that falls
from a tree has a very special meaning, but for another person that is not
enlightened the whole tree could fall on him and still nothing. 
-
Love,
Von



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Denise Clausen 
Subject: Re: coincidence

Debee L. Thomas wrote:
> 
> > it is very insightful and informative.
> 
> Yes, this is a very good book.  It causes much thought.
> 
> > My biggest shock with this book was to find that the dedication seemed to be
> > written directly to me, which is of course normally not possible. :)
> 
> I guess my biggest shock was in discovering that it was fiction.  I guess
> I had wanted to believe it was real :)  However, fiction or not, it still
> discusses much of what we experience on our spiritual journeys to some
> degree or another.
> 
> Blessed Be
> 
> Debee


One of the first things that I learned was that there is no such thing as
coincidence!



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: HB28277ATNOSPAMsprynet.com
Subject: Re: Mysterious Forces

On Wed, 21 Aug 96, Richard Satin  wrote:
>Reading Dan Gahlinger's last post led me to wonder about something very
>strange which was sent to me in the last few hours.  It was a "web-postcard"
>of sorts, indicating that someone named mysteriousATNOSPAMsomewhere.com had sent a
>voodoo doll.
>
>I accessed the site, and sure enough, it was a pretty horrible java enabled
>multimedia experience.  The message was very odd, too.  I was left not
>knowing if this was intended for me, or if the person felt I was doing this
>to them???
>
>If anyone here on the list was responsible, please enlighten me.  Or if
>anyone has any comments.
>
>Richard
>
>>Lord Mysterious (e-mail address: mysteriousATNOSPAMsomeplace.com , apparently
>>logged in from 166.41.230.167 ) has
>>                                        sent you a message: 
>>                                   Who do that voodoo you do so well?
>
>libraATNOSPAMexecpc.com     http://www.execpc.com/~libra/
>............................................................................
>Having served on various committees, I have drawn
>up a list of rules: Never arrive on time; this stamps you as a
>beginner. Don't say anything until the meeting is half over; this
>stamps you as being wise. Be as vague as possible; this avoids
>irritating the others. When in doubt, suggest that a subcommittee
>be appointed. Be the first to move for adjournment: this will make
>you popular; it's what everyone is waiting for.
>Harry Chapman
>
>



             Be careful about what you down load. There is a virus going 
around called the "Hare Krishna virus". Watch CNN television today(friday,
23, August)
                                    Michael


-
Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: LwMema3ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: The Guru Thing

I just have one question--- did you pick a 747 leaving New York and going to
Paris for a reason... considering recent events?  It stuck me pretty hard.
 Did anyone else notice this?  Yes I know it is a bit off the subject? Let me
know.

In light and love,
Lori



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Royale Jills 
Subject: Re: The Phoenix

Dan, we are currently nearing the end of the age 
of Pisces. ( about 300 yrs left.) 
Royale



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: LwMema3ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: also ill

Wendy,
I loved your list of the Top Ten Reasons: Esp. #6 It has to be Rod Sterling-
Welcome to the Twillight Zone!  LOL!!!!!  Thanks it will give me something to
smile about all day while doing the mundane- domestic chores of life- Laundry
(must be done :D )

I also agree that we are all in this together!
I draw so much support from everyone here!  THANKS!

L&L,
Lori
-


Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Royale Jills 
Subject: Re: K and CFS

I have not know of any connection between K. and health although there probalby is.
I do know that fully realized people do get sick and even die.  Royale

-

Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: LwMema3ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Royale- Re: 'Neat way to crucify Kundalini'

Royale,
I agree with you, I have often thought of K energy as Earth energy, as well.
 That is one of the original ways it was described to me and from what I have
seen it remains so, IMHO.  
Everyone-
Feel free to agree or disagree with me, it is one way to learn, also in my
humbel opinion.

Peace to all today,
Lori

Yes, I have been posting a lot, trying to make up for lost time. :D  Enjoy 


-
Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: Denise Clausen 
Subject: Re: K and CFS

JheyeATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:
> 
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> My name is Jennifer and I am new to the list.  I have had chronic fatigue
> syndrome for 9 years.  I worked through most of my illness, but over the past
> almost 4 years I have been too sick to work and have been on disability.
>  Over the past month or so I have been experiencing the symptoms of the
> movement of Kundalini- involuntary body movements, belly breathing, etc.  I
> work with two energy healers who have assured me that I am having a K
> experience.  I am wondering if anyone has ever come to Kundalini through
> illness.  Has anyone been cured from illness  after going through K?  This,
> of course is my hope, but I have been feeling more tired than ever.  Thanks
> for any advice/feedback that you could give to a newcomer to the experience
> of Kundalini.
> 
> Jennifer

I have been very depleted at times and these are the times that seem to be when 
kundalini strikes the hardest!
   Denise



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: LwMema3ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: coincidence to Dan

Dan-
You asked me what my message was that I want to pass along?
Well, you ask he tough ones don't you.... :)  I am not entirely sure- I feel
as if I have so much more to learn- I pass on what I have learned to those
individuals who seem to need it at the time if we come to a subject that I
have learned about.  I love talking about metaphysics etc.  However, I feel
that as a message mine may be that children are the most psychic and use this
abilities naturally until they are told that they do not work or that they
don't exist.  I think that is a crime to do that to a child!  I would love to
work with children to develop their psychic abilities.  I guess that might be
it for now- in case you can't tell I am unsure... still want more answers
that is why I like to learn.  Everyone on this list has so much valuable
information and when I read the information here I realize how far I have to
go.  But it is a journey that I have no interest in ending- it is my life's
path to continue on...  That is all for now.  If you'd like to take this
thread off the list e mail me directly, I don't want to get too far off track
on the Kundalini list... :D
-
Light, Love and Peace,
Lori 



Date: Fri, 23 Aug 1996 
From: LwMema3ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: eyes, flashes of light

I do have recently begun to experience flashes of light at night when I go to
sleep.  Mine are bright, white streaks that seem to play out on a movie
scrren which are the backs of ky eye lids.  Last night for the first time I
had almost a spontaneous OBE.  I was probably 2/3rd of the way out when I was
jolted back like something stopped me- like I hit a brick wall.  It was quite
strange, I had just laid down and not even tried to do anything when itall
began.  I am experiencing all this wierdness too.  Is it normal for some many
people to have the 'same type' of K expeience at the 'same time'- or is it
that we are all talking about it right now?

Sending light and love to you all,
Lori
(Still trying to catch up on all the old mail.... :D )