kundalini-l-d Digest				Volume 96 : Issue 201 

Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: GTATransAMATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: Domestic Violence/K?

I would tend to agree with Kenneth Ring's and Holly's observations about
childrens' altered states of awareness
-
Kurt




Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Jim Cook 
Subject: Revelations

-  This seems to have a Kundalini content to it but
  Maybe I'm wrong.

  Any Biblical scholars out there ?

  Revelation 12: 1-4
  And there appeared a great wonder in the heaven. A women
  clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet,
  and upon her head  a crown of twelve stars.
  (2) And she being with child cried travailing in birth and, pained
-  to be delivered.
  (3) And there appeared another wonder in heaven and behold
  a great red dragon having seven heads, and ten horns,
  and seven crowns upon its head.
  (4) And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven,
  and did cast them to earth and the dragon stood before the women
  which was ready to be delivered,
  for to devour her child as soon as it was born.


-
Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Jan Watson 
Subject: Re: Saturday-Night-Kundalini-Feeber

Hi

Sexual content follows, so delete or go to Go and collect, well...


-









Go

Great message to read first thing in the morning to refocus the eyes.  I 
did't know whether I should start saving money to to to Brazil to visit 
you or sympathize with  "the woman" as you put it.  I guess from you, I 
expected a reference to your partner as perhaps, "my beloved" or 
something loving, rather than the objective term, like the glass that 
holds the water, the generic female.  

I know intellectually that that is not the case, that you love her as 
womankind, that you would not use her for your own development,  Yet most 
 of humanity (I think, but could be wrong) also wants to be loved as an 
individual not as a marvelous representative of their sex and humanity as 
a prerequisite to being made loved to.  

I can think of many men that I LOVE because they are humans that I have 
gotten to know, but I don't hop into bed with them because of the almost 
spiritual love I have for them.  I'm in  a state of paradox here as I 
write and I recognize it and maybe that's why I'm writing.  How do you 
keep from hurting the very human side of your partners when you walk out 
next day and say, "Yes, I do LOVE you, but then, I LOVE all women."  
Maybe its easier as a male - its accepted as part of your mythology; it 
is definitely not acceptable in the mythologies men write for women.

And yes, I can accept that sex and K go hand in hand. Today, as the 
energy around me tingles in a wonderfully sensual way, I could not deny 
that without denying my very self.  But surely, the second chakra energy 
is not just procreative energy, it is also creative energy.   Can you 
tell us a little about that part?  How does one transform the one into 
higher levels (not the mechanical stuff, I know how to 'draw' it up the 
spine etc, but the metaphysics of it?)  

Looking forward to hearing more 'awakening' stories,

jan





-
Antaris Ra wrote:



> >
> > Beloved Ones:
> > After having my Tantra early tonight, I feel great
> >
> > spoiler
> > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
> >
> > go on:
> >
> > It was a great cosmic orgasm (or orgasmus, like we say),
> > reaching the highest 3-D-elevations just before entering the
> > fifht dimension; feeling this great ONENES of man and woman,
> > feeling that high creative process and this force of sexual
> > energy, the penis is to become bigger and bigger and the woman
> > gets one orgsam after the other in a row. This liberated sexual
> > energy helps us to preform into higher realms and as someone
> > from the k-list wrote, "some of this energy is directly absorbed
> > by the higher self."
> > So lets go on!
> > Have good "Tantras" tonight!
> > Love simply IS
> > Antaris
> > limiteATNOSPAMinfonet.com.pyGot it?!


-
Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: "Your friend at:" 
Subject: Re: Saturday-Night-Kundalini-Feeber

Dear Jan, 

	Before we can talk about cakras, is our sense gratification free
from cruelty and violence?  All energies must be directed back to the
spiritual dimension.  The cakras themselves are external.  We must limit
attachment to the temporary body to do this.  In regards to the lower
tongue, it needs to be limited at least to its normal function of
procreation.  If done in communion with the divine self may guarantee the
conception of spiritually enhanced human being.  Yes, it is a lifelong
struggle.  Sri Krsna has declared lust to be the sinful enemy of
self-realization.  

Sincerely, 

cj
-


************************
"The person who is not disturbed by happiness and distress and is steady
               in both is certainly eligible for liberation."
                        Bhagavad gita as it is 2.15

***********************

On Sun, 20 Oct 1996, Jan Watson wrote:

> Hi
> 
> Sexual content follows, so delete or go to Go and collect, well...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go
> 
> Looking forward to hearing more 'awakening' stories,
> 
> jan
> 
> 
> 



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Christopher Williams 
Subject: What's Qi?

In message ,
BlueSky876ATNOSPAMaol.com writes
>Has anyone heard of meditating beyond the Qi?
>I always thought that Qi was everything. One of my classmates states that he
>goes beyond the Qi during his daily meditations. I didn't ask him to
>elaborate.
>Any comments?????
>Peace to all.......Kathleen
->

Is Qi another name for Ch'i, if not what is it?

Christopher Williams  



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Christopher Williams 
Subject: Re: Revelations

In message , Jim Cook
 writes
>  This seems to have a Kundalini content to it but
>  Maybe I'm wrong.
>
>  Any Biblical scholars out there ?
>
>  Revelation 12: 1-4
>  And there appeared a great wonder in the heaven. A women
>  clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet,
>  and upon her head  a crown of twelve stars.
>  (2) And she being with child cried travailing in birth and, pained
>  to be delivered.
>  (3) And there appeared another wonder in heaven and behold
>  a great red dragon having seven heads, and ten horns,
>  and seven crowns upon its head.
>  (4) And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven,
>  and did cast them to earth and the dragon stood before the women
>  which was ready to be delivered,
>  for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
>

I do not know what K has to say about this but the Kabbalah and
especially the Golden Dawn have masses to say. 

Christopher Williams  


-
Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: BlueSky876ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: Christopher

Christopher,
You are correct. Qi is the chinese word for Chi. ( the american way )
Qi is the creation of life. The creation of Yin/Yang which created all.
If Qi is everything, how is it possible to go beyond this great energy?

The chinese say.....O is everything and i comes out of the O,  (see the Q
giving birth to the i) The i from th e Q becomes the person.
O.....Q......i
Love and light....Kathleen



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: WorcaATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: open heart
-
David,
In a message dated 96-10-18 09:02:40 EDT, you write:

>Wow, did that paragraph ever touch a responsive chord in me! Working on
>feeling secure in myself is something I have been having to do for some time
>now. As I progress in this experience, I find it becomes easier and
>easier.....most of the time.  
>Yes, it truly is amazing. Thank you for your post. It was eye-opening for me
>and I needed it this morning.
-
Thank you for your appreciation.  That ALWAYS feels good!

I think I am supposed to tell you about a visualization I used last night.
 My intent was to build that foundation of safety & security without having
to have it triggered first to realize it still needed building.  Make sense?
 I didn't want to wait for some kind of attack to work on inner security &
safety - I wanted to work on it anyway, just to build the foundation
stronger, to actually PREVENT any attacks, or to be ready for them if they
came.
-
I was working with different pictures of what "my foundation" should look and
feel like, metaphorically.  I played with cement blocks, bricks, etc., but
when I came to STONE, I had "my" answer.  I love rocks, minerals, & crystals;
use them in healing, opening up, etc.  So I have a natural affinity for
stone.  But do you know what I used as mortar to bind the stones together?
 Rubber.  Flexible, waterproof, will help the walls of stone BEND with the
wind or flood or whatever, but still be solid & stable.  And in the stones
themselves is contained ancient wisdom & vibrations, all different from each
other, but vibrating in harmony with one another to make something stronger
than any stone alone could make.

So now, when/if I get triggered, flamed, blamed, etc., I will go back to my
foundation of security & safety, and bend WITH the wind, or flood, or
earthquake, NOT against.  My foundation doesn't crumble, it's totally safe.
 I also carry the ancient wisdom & vibrations of the stones making up my
foundation to tap into whenever I need answers or help.  I am never alone.

I have found it immensely helpful to work with metaphors.  I know not all do,
but I offer this idea in order to spur your own creativity.  Happy day
dreaming!

Continued Blessings,  Barb ATNOSPAM--}}--}}--



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Mary Knapp 
Subject: Re: Revelations

The Book of Revelations always seemed to me like someone's recollections of
their bad LSD trip.  It still does.

Along those same lines, the 'Salem Witches' are now thought to have been
affected by a wheat fungus that has hallucinogenic properties.

A different way to think about these things...

Mary

-

At 04:18 AM 10/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
>  This seems to have a Kundalini content to it but
>  Maybe I'm wrong.
>
>  Any Biblical scholars out there ?
>
>  Revelation 12: 1-4
>  And there appeared a great wonder in the heaven. A women
>  clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet,
>  and upon her head  a crown of twelve stars.
>  (2) And she being with child cried travailing in birth and, pained
>  to be delivered.
>  (3) And there appeared another wonder in heaven and behold
>  a great red dragon having seven heads, and ten horns,
>  and seven crowns upon its head.
>  (4) And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven,
>  and did cast them to earth and the dragon stood before the women
>  which was ready to be delivered,
>  for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
>
>
>



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: "Your friend at:" 
Subject: Re: What's Qi?
-
To whom it may concern, 

	Praying all is well this sunday morning. 

	I would like to say that Qi, Ch'i, and prana are more or less the
same thing.

Sincerely, 

Christopher


*************************
"The person who is not disturbed by happiness and distress and is steady
               in both is certainly eligible for liberation."
                        Bhagavad gita as it is 2.15

*************************

On Sun, 20 Oct 1996, Christopher Williams wrote:
> 
> Is Qi another name for Ch'i, if not what is it?
> 
> Christopher Williams  
> 
> 



-
Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Christopher Williams 
Subject: Experience - long account.

This account was given to me by Dick Richardson. I've known Dick for six
or seven years and we have discussed this event many times. I've posted
it here because both of us would be interested in hearing of any other
experiences which might be related to it. Was this a one off or are
there others out there who have been through this experience??
-

               Transcendence- A Personal Experience

It happened when I was 24, about 7.00pm on a winter's evening My wife
had gone out for the evening, my two young children were in bed and 1
was listening to some music (the last part of Elgar's Enigma Variations.
and Vaughan Williams' Fantasia on a Theme of Thomas Tallis), with my cat
purring on my lap. The music began to sound like nothing I had ever
heard before or since: it was as though the music was trying to make me
aware of IT it permeated my consciousness in a way words cannot describe
It was more than mere music, more than mere sound Suddenly, something
very strange occurred. It was as though my concentration became sharply
focused, like a narrow beam of pointed consciousness the music reached a
degree of profound beauty which I had never known or thought could have
existed. I somehow relaxed into it, a land of letting go of objective
observation, and, just as I did so, everything vanished.

There was no room, no cat, no fire burning, no chair, no body, weight
mass, heat cold, just total blackness and the sound of the music,
passing through my consciousness in waves, each wave of greater
emotional charge than the one before it. It was like being kidnapped by
divine music, perfection; the only thing that existed in creation was
myself and the music, a reality in which there was no dualistic
reference between myself and music, but as though there was only AM the
music' in a dance, a swoon, excitement, awe and wonder After an
immeasurable duration of time that piece of music ended, and there was a
stillness and a quiet that cannot be described The next piece of music
seemed to flow out of nothingness, and within a few seconds of the music
entering my consciousness there came the most frightening experience I
have ever known in my life The passion and beauty of the sounds were
such that my mind seemed to explode. As it did so, I could see, 1 had
vision - no longer in total blackness - exploding and expanding.

I could still hear the music and could see what could only be described
as streaked out dots of light into which I was expanding and flying
through, like a flight through a supernova. The expansion stopped, the
dots of light turned into the music, which I could still hear, and now
see - there are no words to describe such music made of light. 1 only
KNEW the music, I became the music. Gradually it faded ( L saw the image
of a boy - myself waving good-bye to the music), and I was alone. Then
something said, or gave me the understanding by way of perceiving a
voice: "Do you want to go on, further?" I was suddenly washed, bathed,
drowned in a passion, a love, a swoon of ecstasy and I responded, "OK
let's go on further". The ecstasy passed and I was alone again, but I
felt my mind bang squeezed, and panicking, but the voice came back
saying, "Relax, take it smoothly!" I felt myself moving, juddering as if
against an obstacle, then a release and bang shot off, as from a gun
into Limbo.

There was no thing to see; no creation other than myself; my mind in
nothing At that point, I became aware of a tiny pinprick of light way
off in the distance. Movement seemed slowly to begin. From nothing, I
became aware that I was drifting past a realm of other beings, hundreds
of than, not seeing them, clearly, but feeling their presence and
somehow 'knowing' them through an empathy of some land; they were so
good: I don't know how I knew that, but I just knew it, and I wanted to
be with them above all else. I could feel them, know them and understand
them somehow, but they said that I could not be with them, not now. Then
1 found myself shooting off at terrific velocity away from their
dimension of existence to the light, which from a pinprick, was now
becoming closer and closer, a beautiful light, a radiant white light. 

Suddenly I was in the white light. What happened seemed so impossible.
How do you describe the impossible I experienced the event twice, from
two different perspectives or points of eference, it thus appearing as
two events from hindsight. This event was of a trinity of some kind; a
trimorphic reality of self in some way Observation is always dualistic,
the observer and the observed, but here it seemed to take place from
three points of reference in sequence I went into the white light - once
but from hindsight it was experienced as going into it twice, though
knowing it only once. I saw the figure of a human form: tall, elegant,
old. standing on top of a high precipice, like a cliff edge. I myself
had no form, but must have had two eyes for the reality was three
dimensional. The space all round was an eerie white mist, yet without
being misty. for vision was crystal clear. The place was calm, serene,
peaceful, poignant, somehow meaningful, but eerie nevertheless, and
strange. I had no thoughts, no feeling no questioning, no power to think
or reason. but simply watching. The figure was looking down in toward
the whiteness, which was not a blinding whiteness but an absolute pure
soft radiance - watching while a small gold ball of light appeared
through a hole in the whiteness. hovering in the white light,
stationary. The figure watched it, me watching it all. in utter
stillness and quiet Somehow it seemed as if the figure may have been an
extension of myself with me having an out of body experience m some
strange way, for I knew what it was thinking As I watched, the figure
shed one solitary tear; yet it was so happy. I know not how I knew it,
but know I did. The vision then suddenly ended, and I had no further
memory or recollection of anything ever happening - or not for a long,
long time to come.
- 
The next instant I was inside some land of 'bubble', like a cobweb
eggshell, beyond the bubble the pure radiance of brilliant dazzling
white light which was getting brighter and brighter, and I felt the
bubble and myself being annihilated, melted down, disintegrating.
Everything ended: everything had gone and I war gone I and the universe
were no more it was the end of time Annihilation For an unknown duration
there was nothing - but after a non duration of time I felt a re-
emergence, or a 'resurrection' of being. The annihilation was like
passing through a gap, in the universe, a hole in creation, a gate
separating time and temporal things from the transcendent realm of a
Divine Eternity, the repose of being. Such death was not death, but
rather the ultimate in living, knowing comprehension and affirmation the
ultimate in level passion, wisdom and understanding That place, the
transcendent realm, seemed to be perfection, paradise. There were no
names. however. it would be misleading to refer to it as 'eternity: time
did not exist there: it seemed the beginning of time, the womb of
eternity; pristine, fresh. child-like, virgin of any other experience or
memory: there were no men or women there, just eternal wisdom itself
Resurrected into it I had ALWAYS been there, there was no before
Paradise is the beginning; and the end is a new beginning - it is both
the beginning and the end, home! From whence we came I had no memory of
ever having existed before there was no before or elsewhere. My
personality was washed away in annihilation, but nevertheless, that
person in paradise was 'ME'. 'I AM ME'.

I was resurrected from non-existence, death, into a place of eternal
perfection. The vision was of a purple glowing darkness, which was not
really dark at all but somehow pulsating with vitality and being, and
with infinite Jewel-like glowing lights. Neither can be described in a
way that would do them justice, for the beauty transcended anything
known or knowable I AM slowing drifted through that realm in a slow
orbit of Vast distance in no perceived substance or form, pure
primordial consciousness, 'spirit stuff or energy' of some kind which
cannot be known, seen or touched However, that realm is not about the
vision, it is about the magic; the knowing, the understanding, the
reality, the knowing the 'ALL', the love, the wisdom, the beauty and.
above all, it is about the purpose of creation and being - and it is
ineffable. It is about 'being there', taking part in the Divine mystical
union of creation at root beyond time, yet whilst in a repose of divine
peace, the 'peace that passes all understanding'. It is where we all
come from the realm where all centres meet beyond space and time: it is
PURE consciousness beyond memory. It (I AM) is the alpha and omega of
all extended minds Before my personality was, I AM. In that eternal
paradise there is only one, and the one is the all (for we are identical
in it) As I drifted in a slow orbit swathed in an ineffable love beyond
words and full rational understanding ill a wisdom beyond dialogue, I
suddenly heard a voice or command (or the experience of one) saying " It
is now time to go!"

Returning was instantaneous action at a distance. I was looking at my
cat fast asleep on my lap, the fire had long since burned away - about
three hours or so had elapsed No amount of words or pages could ever sum
up my initial feelings and thoughts on returning to physical
consciousness and the same life that 1 had seemingly left millions of
years ago 1 must have sat staring at the wall ahead of me for the next
hour, dumb-struck it was no 'dream' There are no words to describe the
'reality' of the experience, the feeling. the shock; the excitement, the
annoyance of coming back. When 1 returned to my full rational senses, I
shouted out to myself, "Good grief what the hell was that!". I was
indeed back to normality, my old charming ignorant self But perhaps not
so ignorant now.

Twenty years later I underwent yet another profound experience - another
kind of union, a  reciprocity of 'meeting again' - and on earth, between
the inner self and the outer personality in a oneness in which I came to
see the connection, the reason, the meaning and purpose of the 'I AM' in
paradise (Paradise IS within - INWARDS, not outwards) Life is deeper and
more mysterious than it appears on the surface alone Other fields of
inter-dimensional consciousness do appear to exist and those can be
lived ill, known and then cause effects in the evolutionary unfolding of
the implicate order of being The 'paradise' of the transcendent order of
being is not a 'becoming', for it is seen the same way by all; there is
no change, no evolution, it is the permanent now' of eternal being.

Richard W. Richardson; 
Wall Cottage, 
24 High Street,
Bishops Lydeard. 
Somerset TA4 3AX
UK         

Christopher Williams  



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Juliet 
Subject: Re: Experience - long account.

Christopher Williams wrote:
> 
> This account was given to me by Dick Richardson. I've known Dick for  
> six or seven years and we have discussed this event many times. I've > posted
> it here because both of us would be interested in hearing of any other
> experiences which might be related to it...

Wow!  Pretty cool.  Your friend's experience has some uncanny
similarities (but without the comic overtones) to the experiences of
Philip K. Dick (science fiction writer, author of the novel Bladerunner
was based on, etc.).  These experiences served as the primary material
for several of his later novels and are fictionalized and represented,
specifically in "Radio Free Albemuth" and "Valis."  I really reccommend
your friend read these--he'll get a kick out of them.  Not only did
music serve as a trigger, but cats figure into the Dickian cosmology as
well.

Another book which treats these experiences (but not in a fictionalized
way) is Lawrence Sutin's great bio of PKD "Divine Invasions."

Juliet



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: redormanATNOSPAMplix.com (Dorman, Robert )
Subject: Re: open heart

Barb wrote: ...

-
>So now, when/if I get triggered, flamed, blamed, etc., I will go back to my
>foundation of security & safety, and bend WITH the wind, or flood, or
>earthquake, NOT against.  My foundation doesn't crumble, it's totally safe.
> I also carry the ancient wisdom & vibrations of the stones making up my
>foundation to tap into whenever I need answers or help.  I am never alone.

My seven year old son, who has learned shamanic practices from me, goes
into "the lower world" (an alternate, or non-ordinary reality which he reaches
by traveling, mentally, down a tunnel into the earth while I beat the drum) to
a cave which is gaurded, both inside and out, with his power animals.  There
he feels totally safe because he knows his power animals will protect him.
After doing this a number of times, he can now go to that place without needing 
the drumming to produce the altered state of consciousness; he just visualizes 
that cave and his power animals.



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Mary Knapp 
Subject: Re: Experience - long account.

At 10:30 AM 10/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Christopher Williams wrote:
>> 
>> This account was given to me by Dick Richardson. I've known Dick for  >
six or seven years and we have discussed this event many times. I've > posted
>> it here because both of us would be interested in hearing of any other
>> experiences which might be related to it...
>
->

Thank you Chris.  This was a pleasure to read.  

I have had a similar experience.  Music was not involved.  It happened while
I was meditating.  I chose to return.  I have never been the same.  I have
many of the symptoms that NDErs have.  The book A Farther Shore was helpful.
It groups this kind of experience with NDE  a n d  Kundalini.  Lots of
comfort and good advice in it.

-		Mary,
	The Reluctant Earthling



Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 
From: Antaris Ra 
Subject: Saturday-Night-Feeber

Beloved Jan:
Beloved Woman:
Beloved Man:
Jan wrote:
 Yet most
 of humanity (I think, but could be wrong) also wants to be loved as an
individual not as a marvelous representative of their sex and humanity as
a prerequisite to being made loved to.

We have to understand that sensual, sexual k-love orientates to  o n e
single person first, in my case to a woman, but as we are all ONE it
goes over that specific woman to all women, but also to all men, because
we are ONE. We have to understand that we are divine persons. We are
daughters and sons of GOD and GOD is individable. The LOVE of GOD can
not be parted, it is for all of us. Being in LOVE with one, means to be
in love with all; therefore the sexual act is a conecting to higher
realms and having an orgasm we are a little bit closer to all.

H o w  this conection to higher realms, to the higher self and at
least to parts of the fith dimension really works, does not matter,
the simple comparation is:
You donATNOSPAMt have to know how the motor of your engine works to drive
your car. You don't have to know in your mind, how kundalini works
(at the end and in details) to be conacted with higher realms.
It is important that you feel good, that you feel be loved and that
you are able to give love to all others.
How does one transformation into higher levels?
Be relaxed. Protect yourself and your aura with the blue-whitegolden
light of Arcangel Michael. Go into kundalini. Go deeper. Go higher.
Feel it, let it grow, let it  h a p p e n ! Then transformation may
o c c u r .
Be open for it. Want it. Want your pure love-light conection to the
fifth dimension.  Y o u  will have it.
The less you ask, the less you think, the sooner you will have it.
Be yourself. Be LOVE. B E  the ONE.
Love simply is,
Antaris
limiteATNOSPAMinfonet.com.py