kundalini-l-d Digest				Volume 96 : Issue 122 

Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: Re: no sleep

When I'm laying in bed, Mozart puts me to sleep before I even begin to 
feel tired.
-
Mac

On Wed, 28 Aug 1996 LwMema3ATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:

> Dear list members,
> Why is it that I can't sleep, when I really need to because I have to get up
> early and will be on campus tomorrow from 9 am to 9:30 pm?  I cannot clear
> the inner turmoil and silence all the inner chatter!!!  It is making me
> crazy!  I cannot stop my thought from raging for one second!  I don't know if
> the energy is just flowing very strongly or if there is too much that I know
> I will ahve to do in the near future with school, home, work, personal life,
> etc.... ?????  Nothing I do seems to work to get centered or to be able to
> shut up long enough to fall asleep!  Why am I so wired?  I am sure this will
> all be a moute point by the time you all can read it, since it is currently
> 1:00 in the morning, but any suggestions for the future- if this happens
> again- would be great.  Normally, I just deal with it and wait until
> exhaustion takes over to be able to sleep.  But, that is on the nights when I
> do not have to be up early and alert and concentrating for 12hours plus.  I
> am frustrated! Help!
> L&L,
> Lori
> 
> 



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: Re: Comments on email lists
-
On Wed, 28 Aug 1996, Richard Satin wrote:

> 
> Humor is wonderful.  I in fact participate in a number of humor lists and
> privately with friends.  There is so much humor that is appropriate for this
> list.  But nothing that is insulting to any person or group of people
> because of some characteristic.  If someone is put down by the humor, it is
> not appropriate to this list.
> 
> I "ignored" the post about women a few weeks ago hoping that it was an
> aberration.  But I was deeply amazed and offended.  This type of thing
> really needs to stop.  If you find my attitude "heavy handed", I am very
> sorry.  But there is obviously a need a little guidance in this area.
> 

I do not think you are heavy handed at all.  

Mac

-

Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: V487ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: Comments on email lists

Hi: Richard

"Don't be offended."   I well tell you straight and that is the way I am.

I can understand your thinking, but may I have the opportunity to disagree
with you? 

> But the following is
completely unacceptable:

>What does "IMHO" mean?
>International  Male  Homosexual Organization.

Did you ask Bill if he was offended?  This post was made in love and I am
sure he understood that and anyway how can you say that it offended any one.
 This statement was just a statement. I never said in any way that he was a
homosexual.  It was just a blank statement only. 

It seems that we disagree on many points and that is ok.  In the future why
don't you send me an e-mail so we can discuss it.  I am not always right and
I don't think you are.   

>There was an earlier post which was extremely insulting to women, but
disguised as humor.  No more details are necessary.
-
I took the blame for this post as it was coming over the Internet for the
whole world to see, but I was the one that put it on the list.  So in that
respect I am at fault.  However I just can not see how you can say that this
is not kundalini.   One of the reasons that I posted this thing in the first
place was because at that time there was such a big discussion going on about
sex.  Which is of course kundalini also and same as my post was.  The context
in those posts was sexual energy with a goddess and all of those things that
sounded a little offensive to me.

So I thought if people can post things like that then they must be aware
enough to understand  what I post also. Most people on the list should be
aware enough to understand that they are not male or female, but a much
higher force.  That was my only reason for posting  and no to offend anyone.

>I am not gay, nor am I a woman.  But there is no real difference between any
of
us in terms of our humanity or worth.

These are your own words so how can you be offended.  I still don't
understand because you are saying two things at one time. Any way if I was
wrong why didn't you send me an e-mail.  Why wait until now and bring it up.
 Why don't you ask the people on the list there opinion.  This is the main
reason that I don't think it is right for the list to be moderated.  Just
because you did not catch it does not mean the other people could not
understand it.  Are we living in Russia?

>Kundalini is a very specific thing which effects many if not all areas of
life.But everything in life is not necessarily kundalini.

Ok I would like to hear your opinion and I will not get offended.  As I don't
agree with you for sure.

Love,
Von



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: WorcaATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: re ADMN message

Richard,

Tej said it nicely for me, as well.  Thanks Tej, for taking the time out to
speak for many of us (I'm assuming "many").

Blessings & Loving Voices,  Barb


-
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: nannuATNOSPAMsuncoastonline.com
Subject: I say moderate!

If this list is about kundalini, then it should be about kundalini. All I see coming 
across is everything but kundalini.



-
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 96 
From: Richard Satin 
Subject: ADMIN: Kundalini-l official position on "humor"


Von,

Whether you consider it just or not, I have to ask that all of us on the
list correspond to a few rules.  One of the rules is that we do not offend
others through inappropriate "humor".  "Jokes" about women and homosexuals
are not in the scope of this list, and are therefore not welcome.  Already
enough has been said about this, and I won't be drawn into any more
discussion with you about it.  This is an unbendable rule.

I received not less than 6 complaints from your women and coffee post. 
Others were so terribly offended that they left the list.  This is
unacceptable - especially as a result of an item which had no business being
posted in the first place.

It is not acceptable to even bring up homosexuality, women, minorities or
any other group of people on this list in the context of "humor".  It
doesn't make any difference what the reasoning is.  You have explained
clearly your reasons for doing so.  But I must step in as the list owner.  I
am the one who pays for this list, in money and much more importantly, time.
 If you think that it feels like Communist Russia, then you are free to
leave at any time.  If you choose to stay, then I must ask you and everyone
else to follow the rules.  It's very simple. 

Again, this is non-negotiable.  
-
Richard


--
libraATNOSPAMexecpc.com     http://www.execpc.com/~libra/
............................................................................
Every day I shall put my papers in order and every day I shall 
say farewell.  And the real farewell, when it comes, will only be 
a small outward confirmation of what has been accomplished 
within me from day to day.
-Etty Hillesum



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: SYL228ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: sleep, and letting go of others.

Lori:
-
I agree with Barb about blue light being helpful for sleep problems.  Blue is
a calming color.  We painted all our bedrooms blue many years ago, and
everyone slept better.  They are pale shades.  You could paint a light bulb
blue, and have a blue light night that might work too.

Barb:

My daughter is going through a period of spiritual growth, and is having to
consider changes in her life.  I dont' interfere.   I would have resented
interference at any age, and I respect that.  I send a lot of love and light.
 It's all any of us can do anyway.

Love Jule  



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: "William P. Wilkes" 
Subject: Re: ADMIN: Kundalini-l official position on "humor"
-
Richard Satin wrote:
> 
> 
> Von,
> 
> Whether you consider it just or not, I have to ask that all of us on the
> list correspond to a few rules.  One of the rules is that we do not offend
> others through inappropriate "humor".  "Jokes" about women and homosexuals
> are not in the scope of this list, and are therefore not welcome.  Already
> enough has been said about this, and I won't be drawn into any more
> discussion with you about it.  This is an unbendable rule.
> 
> I received not less than 6 complaints from your women and coffee post.
> Others were so terribly offended that they left the list.  This is
> unacceptable - especially as a result of an item which had no business being
> posted in the first place.
> 
> It is not acceptable to even bring up homosexuality, women, minorities or
> any other group of people on this list in the context of "humor".  It
> doesn't make any difference what the reasoning is.  You have explained
> clearly your reasons for doing so.  But I must step in as the list owner.  I
> am the one who pays for this list, in money and much more importantly, time.
>  If you think that it feels like Communist Russia, then you are free to
> leave at any time.  If you choose to stay, then I must ask you and everyone
> else to follow the rules.  It's very simple.
> 
> Again, this is non-negotiable.
> 
> Richard
> 
> --
> libraATNOSPAMexecpc.com     http://www.execpc.com/~libra/
> ............................................................................
> Every day I shall put my papers in order and every day I shall
> say farewell.  And the real farewell, when it comes, will only be
> a small outward confirmation of what has been accomplished
> within me from day to day.
> -Etty Hillesum

Dear Richard, I AM Bill, and that IMHO business taught me to not use
abbreviations at all!  So much for that.

I am overwhelmed by the NUMBER of postings, but what can be done about
that and still ensure that I don't miss the one message that helps me
immensely on my way?

The only thing I can see that will reduce and/or stop clearly irrelevant
messages from entering the list is for NO ONE to answer them.  That's
it.  Ignore them and they must cease.  Their only source of reward or
reinforcement is attention.  Must of US seek answers to questions vital
to our spiritual development.  Let's just starve the interlopers out.

I could not trust myself to censor the list.  Who else COULD I trust?



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: V487ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: ADMIN: Kundalini-l official position on "humor"
-
Hi: Richard

I agree that you pay the bills and are the owner, but that still does not
make you right.

                                I like it when you say:
                          "Again, this is non-negotiable."


Now I know where you are coming form.    You should have explained to me the
first time that I joined this list that you are the boss,  pay the bill and
nothing that I say is negotiable.

I will keep this thing in mind and I am really am surprised at you, Richard.
 

 Ok the light has hit me and no more comments.  As you said  "Again, this is
non-negotiable."

-
Love,
Von



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: nannuATNOSPAMsuncoastonline.com
Subject: Just stay on the subject,...period!

It's easy enough,..just keep the subject where it belongs...KUNDALINI!



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: "William P. Wilkes" 
Subject: Re: ADMIN: Kundalini-l official position on "humor"

V487ATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:
> 
> Hi: Richard
> 
> I agree that you pay the bills and are the owner, but that still does not
> make you right.
> 
>                                 I like it when you say:
>                           "Again, this is non-negotiable."
> 
> Now I know where you are coming form.    You should have explained to me the
> first time that I joined this list that you are the boss,  pay the bill and
> nothing that I say is negotiable.
> 
> I will keep this thing in mind and I am really am surprised at you, Richard.
> 
> 
>  Ok the light has hit me and no more comments.  As you said  "Again, this is
> non-negotiable."
> 
> Love,
> Von
-
Von, it's one thing to be right, and quite another thing to walk in love
and the light, and to want with your whole heart to put that above
everything else.

Which one would you put above the other?



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: "Daniel L. Rusch-Fischer" 
Subject: Re: ADMIN:  Important Questions - Please Respond

Richard Satin wrote:
1.  Do you find the volume of mail acceptable?
	The volume gets large, but I have no problem dealing with it. 
2.  If too much, would you prefer a moderated list?
	We all get 'off track' occasionally - moderation would be in order
	to keep the list a bit more 'linear'. Regular chat could be directed
	to an IRC line such as Wendy suggests.
3.  Have you been offended by any posts or posters?
	On occasion (no not you Von), but on reflection is was more a
	result of my own errors and prejudices than intent of offense by
	the poster. It is tough, but when I feel offended, I try to handle
	it by examining my own tolerance level - doesn't always work. Boy!
	is that true sometimes.
4.  How would you like to see the list changed?
	Other than a little help linearizing it, seems to serve a fair
	number of the users - is there anything we could do to assist in
	the nuts-and-bolts? It seems like an awfully big share of the load
-	that you bear Richard just for having the 'owner' title.



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 96 
From: John Halonen 
Subject: Kundalini - Catalyst or Energy? and Kundalini mailing list.


Ok, which is it.  I've heard people call it the catalyst that sets off your
energy.
But I don't recall reading this in a book.
Is it an energy unto itself waiting to be awakened at the base of the spine?
Is it a light switch that enables us to see?
or is it "E" all of the above.

I am now feeling more and more vibrations inside of me.  Becoming more and
more aware of my physical body
has brought me more in touch with my energy body.  But I still have no clue
as to what Kundalini is.  It it said that it needs to be experienced to
understand it.  But I don't really care what it is, because when it happens,
it will happen.

What can really be said about kundalini?  Only talk of energy, chakras,
mudras, asanas, meridians, tongue on roof of mouth :), nadis, shushumna,
prana, apana, aum.  Chant all you want.  Until you realize you are chanting
you make a horrible noise.

There is a silly saying my wifes uncle says all the time,"Wherever you go,
there you are."  Everyone used to laugh at this.  Not realizing how true it
really is.  If you are not there, you are not in touch with the moment. 
Your mind is off travelling.  You need to be in the moment.  There you are.

It seems you can only talk about before and after.  Because once you
experience kundalini you won't talk about it.

Just some thoughts

Peace and love,
John H.
-


Date: Wed, 28 Aug 96 
From: John Halonen 
Subject: Kundalini Mail


Kundalini is an enigma.

It is almost impossible to bring it to be moderated.

Of course it might not exist at all if not for Richard. Thank you.

But how can anyone in search of enlightenment be offended?  It is a great
chance to move closer to enlightenment.  Reach inside and find out where
this offense comes from.  You will find it is not you, but what others have
told you.

What you have to decide, is this a place to share feelings or data about
kudalini?
Recognition of all the dual emotions must be part of the process.  To rule
out these posts  would leave a false impression on someone seeking
information.

I am only here searching and becoming and living and loving.

Peace and love,
John Halonen

-

Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: DUANE YOUNG 
Subject: Fwd: Anonymous Post (Synchrophrenia)

Is this your experience?  -Duane

>>From: 	GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com[SMTP:GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com]
>>(snipped portion)...As the self dies off duality slowly disappears. One
>>becomes
>>absorbed into the Christ Frequency or Christ Consciousness, that is when
>there is only one thing remaining...

>



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: ori^ 
Subject: Subject: kundalini/ADMIN questions

At 15:30 8/28/96 +0000, nannuATNOSPAMsuncoastonline.com wrote:
>It's easy enough,..just keep the subject where it belongs...KUNDALINI!

I second this motion.
I joined the list to discuss, learn, and listen to others about
experiences, techniques for working with, understandings, etc. 
with and about kundalini.

I understand we may each have different perspectives, and I'd like
to request that if you have something to share which relates to the 
topic of kundalini, please clarify how you see that it relates if
it might not be apparent to others.

>Richard Satin wrote:
>1.  Do you find the volume of mail acceptable?

It has been a bit much lately, especially multiple postings by
individuals which are often responses to others which perhaps
would have been better off directed to the individual than to
the list.

>2.  If too much, would you prefer a moderated list?

My preference is a self-moderated list, which means we might have
to remind one another from time to time about how to keep the list
as we would like it.  Only if that proves not to work would I vote
for a moderated list.

>3.  Have you been offended by any posts or posters?

Yes.  Primarily the previously mentioned posts which were
masquerading as "humor."  Sometimes I have sent email directly 
to the individual, to open a dialogue about this, other times I 
simply delete the email.

>4.  How would you like to see the list changed?

I would like to ask people to consider if your responses to 
others would also be of interest to the other 100+ people on the 
list, or just to the individual you are responding to.  Sometimes 
it is best to send a response of agreement, or "Been there, done 
that" directly to the person, rather than to the list.


As someone pointed out, Wendy has started a channel on IRC
undernet and a few of us have met there at times for more
general chatting.  All are welcome to join.

Thank-you Richard for your efforts!!
ori^
************************
*        ori^          *   
*  mermaidATNOSPAMeskimo.com  *
************************



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: nannuATNOSPAMsuncoastonline.com
Subject: This 'IS' Kundalini

There is a branch in the scientific community that believes the
cosmos was created by some sort of atomic explosion,...the big bang
theory, and that the universe is expanding at an enormous rate. An atomic
explosion is created by the splitting of the atom.
     The Bible starts our creation with Adam. (Adam,..atom...?) He was
also split,...into male and female, and is expanding at an enormous rate.
Coincidence?
-
     There are many theories about where we come from, but if we strip
away the possibles, we are left with one undeniable FACT. If we know
nothing else, we know we came from sex. This being the only FACT that
we have, ...what better place to start our search...

     Both male and female come from the 'same mold', and within
each of us is the genetic code of both sexes. This is why men have
breast's, yet cannot feed the infant, and women have a penis(clitoris),
yet can't father a child
-
     The sole purpose of Kundalini is to unite the male and female
aspects of our being. The culmination of this 'union', which is as much
physical as it is mental, results in the birth of a new being, which is now
correctly balanced, whole and complete, and sees the world from a
new perspective. Thus one becomes 'enlightened' as to one's true
nature. 'Awakened', if you will to the bigger picture.
     "A rose by any other name is still a rose" can be equally applied to
kundalini. I have found it in every culture and religion throughout the
world, including Christianity. In the trinity 'Father, Son and Holy Ghost=
',
Ghost is representative of the inner female, and Son is the product of
the union of the Father and the inner female. It is also applicable as
'Mother, daughter, and Holy Ghost, wherein Ghost represents the inner
male, and again Daughter being the product of the union between
the mother and the inner male.

     Dangers? Depends on the individual. Concepts, upbringing,
experiences, physical attributes. All have a bearing on the outcome.
But again, If we know nothing else about what we're going to do in this
life, we know we're going to die. The question now becomes, do we
want to die trying to understand who, what, why, etc.,...or do we sit in
the corner and wait for death to find us...?



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: "Michael J. Davis" 
Subject: Re: ADMIN:  Important Questions - Please Respond

>1.  Do you find the volume of mail acceptable?  Too much?  Too little?
>

I find the level to be acceptable. I think that a good portion of the
messages could be sent directly, but that is what a delete key is for!

>2.  If too much, would you prefer a moderated list?  This is a list where
>only posts which have been reviewed by the moderator(s) are posted.  This
>keeps the list to a manageable size and insures that the threads stay to the
>topic.  
>

No matter what the decision here, in some form or fashion the list is
moderated. The question is how tightly. It is your list, so even if all
posts go to the group, you still have control over content as was
demonstrated by Von's remarks which offended so many  (few) people. All that
really matters is if it offends the list owner. Not that this is wrong!!! I
prefer a loose management style like what I have seen up until today.

>3.  Have you been offended by any posts or posters?  If so, how and why?  
>(Note that this information will be read only by me - and will be deleted
>when I am finished.  It will remaing confidential.)
>

No I have not. I prefer the attitude of "humor towards all, malice towards
none". Unless it is directed specifically to someone in particular, I do not
see how they can become offended. But, that again is just my opinion.

>4.  How would you like to see the list changed?  Or, do you like it just the
>way it is?
>
Is there a FAQ for this list? The reason that I ask is because I have seen
alot of folks supposedly talking about kundalini and I feel like the group
(at that time) should be alt.newage.outthere or something. while kundalini
can be interpretated in a few different ways, I often find myself wondering
if everyone is on the same page.


Thank you sir, for taking the time to ask. A few other lists that I am on
would not have bothered to see what their subscribers would be interested in.
-
Michael
*******************************
Michael J. Davis
Independent Network Consultant
mjdavisATNOSPAMcompassnet.com
----------------------------------------------------------------
It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows
	Epictetus (50 - 138 AD)

-

Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: Royale Jills 
Subject: Royales Home Page

http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/1044/


                            Naturopathy 
(Natural healing) and astrology is now being wedded in order
to facilitate a healthy program of living.


This way it can customize an individuals needs and remedies,
whether it be for
herbs, hydropathy, diet, or answers to questions from you.
Stay tuned for later developments, Still under Construction.
Royale Jills, B.A., N.D.

-

Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: Re: Comments on email lists

Since I got my sense of humor when my brain blasted into a million shards of
Light with K, I consider this an appropriate post to the K list.  And, I'm
keeping mine (humor, that is, who needs a brain anymore) and I *cherish*
Von's and everyone else's.
-
Love,
Wendy


>From: Wendy 
>Subject: Re: Comments on email lists
>
>>Wendy:
>>	I'm the "Bill" mentioned just above.  I was over 40 yrs old before I
>>ever met a group of people who could joke about one another without
>>being cruel.  It amazed me.  Where have people like this been all my
>>life?  Most humor requires someone or some thing to be the butt of a
>>joke.  If Love is lacking, so is any worth for us.
>>         Sincerely,  Bill
>>
>
Even Love is funny, isn't it Bill?  Look in the mirror  

Love,
Wendy



Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: ADMIN: Kundalini-l official position on "humor"

Dear Richard and All,

I love this list just the way it is.  

Somedays I wanna chuck it all and bail.  Other days I'm shivering with
affirmations from others' posts.  More days than not, I pick up on a lot of
Love here.  Peeking out from behind the personalities and words on the screen.

Love,
Wendy