kundalini-l-d Digest				Volume 96 : Issue 108 


Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Karol Ann Barnett 
Subject: Re: The guru thing

I have come to a different conclusion over time.
-

> I for one have a great deal of trouble with "paying" for "spirituality". If
> it is "real" then they should not ask for such. If they do ask for such, I
> assume they are not legitimate and move on. Sorry but that's the only way I
> can differentiate the "true" spiritualists versus the carnival sideshows. 
> 

I used to feel exactly the same way, making judgments against people 
who charge a fee for a service.  I don't think that way anymore.
Money is condensed energy, a feedback mechanism that tells me how well I 
am succeeding in my reality.  It speaks to abundance and to love (not 
self-indulgent love) but self-nurturing love of comfort and security in a 
physical world.  Like the Money Tree that is in essence, the gifts of the 
Goddess who loves us without condition and never has wanted us to be 
without anything that brings us joy.  Yes, there is the danger of 
becoming trapped in the physical manifestations, but that is what this 
world is all about -- overcoming the traps.  There is no nobility in 
poverty anymore, unless one chooses to live the austere life for their 
growth.  But it is not a mandate that we have to deny ourselves in order 
to be spiritual -- at least, not for me.  I guess we each have to make 
that choice.  Karol Ann



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Karol Ann Barnett 
Subject: RE: Ringing in the ears, flashes of light, and crawly feelings.

Ah, John, sometimes I wish I had your attitude toward these things.
But I don't.  Yet.  I have a tremendous desire to know and understand 
what I am experiencing and why.  Maybe the k will temper that, or expand 
it, I don't yet know.  *8-)

On Wed, 21 Aug 1996, John Halonen wrote:

> 
> These are things that need to be experienced.
> 
> If you see flashes of light, don't worry about what they are.
> Don't worry about getting rid of the crawly feeling.
> 
> Just experience them, then when they are gone.  They are gone.
> But remember to watch and experrience.  That is the key.
> Then when they are gone, experience the next moment
> with no thought of the flashing lights.
> 
> There will probably be a great joy there.
> 
> Peace,
> John Halonen
> 
> 



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Mary Knapp 
Subject: Re: k and pain...

At 03:14 PM 8/21/96 -0400, Dan Gahlinger wrote:
. I
>don't like it. that's not to say I dont like or want k, but, there has to be
>a better way. :)
>
>Dan.


I could not have said it better myself, Ollie.  Let us join in asking for a
better way, shall we?
-
Mary



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Mary Knapp 
Subject: Re: John's Laws

At 03:01 PM 8/21/96 -0500, John Halonen wrote:
-
>5.	Nothing needs to be perfect, or life would be a bore.
>6.	Mother Nature is You.
>7.	Everything is going well, as long as it is going.


My personal favorites.

Yes, we sick people definitely have too much time on our hands just now.

M>



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Mary Knapp 
Subject: Re: The guru thing

At 12:29 AM 8/22/96 +0500, tejkohliATNOSPAMgiasdl01.vsnl.net.in wrote:
 I feel the energy likes us to to do things our own 
>way and to discover things in our own way. Each one of us are an 
>expression of that vast creative power, and we have to respect that 
>expression of creation(us) first.
>
>TEj



I am coming to believe that this is true as well.  It took me a while.
Perhaps it is not true for all, but could be after some purification, after
some initiation maybe.  I felt Jesus led me here - state of mind, K, the
whole 9 yrds.

Further ramblings from the strep front,
M  
>
>
>


-
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: "Debee L. Thomas" 
Subject: Re: coincidence

> it is very insightful and informative.

Yes, this is a very good book.  It causes much thought.

> My biggest shock with this book was to find that the dedication seemed to be
> written directly to me, which is of course normally not possible. :)

I guess my biggest shock was in discovering that it was fiction.  I guess 
I had wanted to believe it was real :)  However, fiction or not, it still 
discusses much of what we experience on our spiritual journeys to some 
degree or another.

Blessed Be

Debee
-


Date: Thu, 22 Aug 1996 
From: Graham Dumpleton 
Subject: Re: Arlene, Dan G,

SYL228ATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:
> 
> Arlene:
> 
> I too have had the experience of being paralized for a minute or two on
> awakening.  The first time it happened my fingers were interlaced together,
> and I was terrified, because I couldn't separate them.  To this day I sleep
> with my hands well away from one another.  I did read somewhere that the
> energy gets intercepted and stopped between the body and the head when we are
> in certain kinds of dream states.

The paralysis is referred to as a cataleptic state. It results in the
suspension of feeling and the ability to control the muscles. It is said
to be a normal part of sleep in that without it, your actions on the
astral would cause some resultant movement in the physical body. Having
your physical body thrashing around when you sleep wouldn't be particularly
desirable. In waking, your consciousness has become aware before the
catalepsy has dissipated, normally this wouldn't happen.

For more information about catalepsy in relation to sleep, dreaming and
astral projection, you might look at "The Projection of the Astral Body"
by Sylvan Muldoon and Hereward Carrington.

--
Graham Dumpleton (grahamdATNOSPAMdscpl.com.au)



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Dan Gahlinger 
Subject: Re: The guru thing

At 02:51 PM 8/21/96 -0700, you wrote:
>I used to feel exactly the same way, making judgments against people 
>who charge a fee for a service.  I don't think that way anymore.
>Money is condensed energy, a feedback mechanism that tells me how well I 
>am succeeding in my reality.  It speaks to abundance and to love (not 
>self-indulgent love) but self-nurturing love of comfort and security in a 
>physical world.  Like the Money Tree that is in essence, the gifts of the 
>Goddess who loves us without condition and never has wanted us to be 
>without anything that brings us joy.  Yes, there is the danger of 
>becoming trapped in the physical manifestations, but that is what this 
>world is all about -- overcoming the traps.  There is no nobility in 
>poverty anymore, unless one chooses to live the austere life for their 
>growth.  But it is not a mandate that we have to deny ourselves in order 
>to be spiritual -- at least, not for me.  I guess we each have to make 
>that choice.  Karol Ann

well perhaps I should not have made my comment so all-encompassing, just
sick of the "psychic fairs" (not that everyone at a psychic fair is a fraud,
but...) my "friend" had an interesting idea, that was to check your vibes on
the people first, he seemed to think he got a different feel from the
"legitimate" ones.
-
Dan.
Dan.
There are always possibilities...



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: eyes, flashes of light
-
John, 
The blue lights come through the throat chakra, that means that where you are
inside when you are seeing the blue lights, green is in the heart and
violet/purple comes down from the third eye and crown centers. Gloria



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: hbarrettATNOSPAMix.netcom.com (Holly N. Barrett, Ph.D.)
Subject: Re: The guru thing

Maimu --  I've treated several ex-Lifespring people in psychotherapy 
and, yes, it sounds like a cult to me.  Most of these organizations 
have a kernel of truth, though.

Best wishes,

Holly

-

Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Karol Ann Barnett 
Subject: Re: The guru thing

> >that choice.  Karol Ann
> 
> well perhaps I should not have made my comment so all-encompassing, just

I did the same thing recently (thanks, Ray)

> sick of the "psychic fairs" (not that everyone at a psychic fair is a fraud,
> but...

i know what you mean -- the psychic unfairs -- there are plenty to go around.

) my "friend" had an interesting idea, that was to check your vibes on
> the people first, he seemed to think he got a different feel from the
> "legitimate" ones.
-
yes, this works very well for me.  it was a gift of the k...
> 
> There are always possibilities...

and that's just in THIS universe.... *8-)
> 
> 


-
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: JheyeATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: K and CFS

Hi Everyone,

My name is Jennifer and I am new to the list.  I have had chronic fatigue
syndrome for 9 years.  I worked through most of my illness, but over the past
almost 4 years I have been too sick to work and have been on disability.
- Over the past month or so I have been experiencing the symptoms of the
movement of Kundalini- involuntary body movements, belly breathing, etc.  I
work with two energy healers who have assured me that I am having a K
experience.  I am wondering if anyone has ever come to Kundalini through
illness.  Has anyone been cured from illness  after going through K?  This,
of course is my hope, but I have been feeling more tired than ever.  Thanks
for any advice/feedback that you could give to a newcomer to the experience
of Kundalini.

Jennifer
-


Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Ralph Ward 
Subject: RE: eyes, flashes of light

interesting,  I have been having brilliant white flashes of light that are 
so fast they are barely perceptible during my waking hours for the last 
couple of weeks.  When I am in a trance, I often have sort of purple rings 
of light decreasing in size and moving to the center.

----------
From: 	Dan Gahlinger[SMTP:danATNOSPAMvrx.net]
Subject: 	eyes, flashes of light

well here's another one to add to the "oddities" list. [grin] we've talked
about changing eye color, and some have mentioned colored rings formed
around the edges of the eyes. now for something similar yet different...

usually when i am about to go to sleep, and just close my eyes, there are
between 2-5 flashes of white light, circles of light that start on the
outside periphery of my vision and move "closer" to me. these brilliant
flashes are not painful at all, and usually only take a fraction of a 
second
each to complete.

I have no idea why I'm mentioning this now, just thought i'd throw another
log onto the "weird" pile. :)

Dan.



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Ralph Ward 
Subject: Unidentified subject!

interestingly, MY sore throat, chills and fever started Friday.....maybe I am a precog!

-
----------
From: 	Dan Gahlinger[SMTP:danATNOSPAMvrx.net]
Subject: 	Re: eyes, flashes of light

At 04:56 PM 8/20/96 -0700, you wrote:
>I don't know whether to laugh or cry at all the similarities I share with
>others on this list.  Right now I too have chills, fever, ear ache, sore
>throat and owerwhelming weakness.  Prayers welcome.  Lights for many many
>years now, during the day too.  This redness near the nose. The skin, the
>feet. Laugh or cry?  At least we found each other.  
>
>On the subject of weird list e-mail, I get mine backwards.  I read replies
>before original posts.
>
>The weirdness plays on.
>
>Mary  

well if i had the energy for either, probably cry. [grin] but i dont. as for
the similarities between people on the list... I can only say one thing:

You all do realize of course that these similarities will only increase more
and more over time? dont you? :)

Dan.
>
>
>
>
>At 03:03 PM 8/20/96 -0400, Dan Gahlinger wrote:
>>well here's another one to add to the "oddities" list. [grin] we've talked
>>about changing eye color, and some have mentioned colored rings formed
>>around the edges of the eyes. now for something similar yet different...
>>
>>usually when i am about to go to sleep, and just close my eyes, there are
>>between 2-5 flashes of white light, circles of light that start on the
>>outside periphery of my vision and move "closer" to me. these brilliant
>>flashes are not painful at all, and usually only take a fraction of a second
>>each to complete.
>>
>>I have no idea why I'm mentioning this now, just thought i'd throw another
>>log onto the "weird" pile. :)
>>
>>Dan.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
-


Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: mxoATNOSPAMpyrite.som.cwru.edu (Maimu Alber)
Subject: Re: The guru thing

At 04:26 PM 8/21/96 -0700, Holly N. Barrett, Ph.D. wrote:
>Maimu --  I've treated several ex-Lifespring people in psychotherapy 
>and, yes, it sounds like a cult to me.  Most of these organizations 
>have a kernel of truth, though.
>
>Best wishes,


>Thanks, Holly....and I suppose it's that kernel that keeps them hanging
on....  

The reason I originally asked is this:   I'm very involved, and have been in
a twelve step fellowship for the past 13 years.  l recently spent time with
friends in NM, and as it turns out, many are now involved in Lifespring.
They no longer associate with others they got clean with except to try to
recruit them.  

A very close friend of mine, who used to be like a father to a young man and
his son, had been rejected by them for a couple of years for various reasons
(he had MS and the young man didn't want to subject the child to a possible
death of a close friend.  His own mother had died a slow death  when he was
18).  Needless to say, my friend didn't die.  (He was healed by a spiritual
healer and homeopathic treatments.)  The young man called my friend one day
to make emotional amends for the way he had treated him, and lots of
promises to make the future better by visiting him with his son, etc...My
friend didn't hear from him again for a long time.  Finally, he was invited
to join the young man and his son for lunch.  My friend was so excited to
see them and spend time together again.  Turns out it was a group lunch, and
the sole purpose was for recruitment into LifeSpring.  My friend was
devastated, to day the least. 

Other stories that I hear from that region are similar, and the LifeSpring
people seem to be creating a division in the same 12-step fellowship which
saved them in the past....

I also hear it was much the same story with The Forum in Dallas not long ago.

Thanks to all for your responses.....

Maimu

----------------------------------------------------------------------
    When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandfather......
-     Not screaming and crying like the passengers in his car did.



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: RE: eyes, flashes of light

what's it all *about* alfie?

physical manifestions or...........is there more.......

Wendy

Leap and the net will appear.
http://www.tiac.net/users/wenders
___________________

       Midnight is when noon is born.       - Chinese proverb
___________________
-


Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: V487ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: John's Laws

Hi: John Halonen

This is my personal opinion.   I am not alway right, but most of the time I
am.

Don't be offended because that is not my intention.

"Did you notice that we agree on almost nothing!" (Nothing)  I have tried
very hard to see what is the problem. 

Do you have any of your own observations concerning this. Does anyone?  It's
just strange to me.

As always,
Von



Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: V487ATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: Re: eyes, flashes of light

Hi: Dan
-
How many Dans are on the list now?

>You all do realize of course that these similarities will only increase more
and more over time? dont you? :)<

No, I don't agree and now think I'am getting the flu, blocked chakras,
burning in the throat,  changing eye color, chills, fever, ear ache, sore
throats, chronic fatigue, crawlings, crawly feeling, lookin like your DOG,
migraines  paralized , pneumonia, really gloomy and rainy, redness near the
nose, strepthroat, and owerwhelming weakness and more sore throats.


Do males have their time of the month also?
See you in the morning.

As always
Von


-
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: mxoATNOSPAMpyrite.som.cwru.edu (Maimu Alber)
Subject: Re: Re: eyes, flashes of light

At 10:10 PM 8/21/96 -0400, V487ATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:
>
> feeling, lookin like your DOG,

Watch it.  I wish some of the men I've met  would look more like my dog.  It
would be an improvement.  I'd also be happy if they sat as quietly as she
does...obeyed as well as she does.... kissed me as often...or snuggled as
warmly...or showed their gratitude as deeply....or were as devoted...or
listened as attentively....

Well...you get the picture....

>
>Do males have their time of the month also?

Yes.  Once a week, at least.

Maimu
a recent divorcee  ;-)


----------------------------------------------------------------------
    When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandfather......
     Not screaming and crying like the passengers in his car did.

-

Date: Wed, 21 Aug 1996 
From: "I.Juster" 
Subject: Re: k and pain...

>To: Dan Gahlinger 
>From: "I.Juster" 
>
>
>>Personally I have a teeny problem with accepting this as part of k, perhaps
>>since my own k was so recent, but I always seem to have trouble with
>>accepting something that is "painful" as part of a process that is supposed
>>to be so good.
>>
>>On the other hand, if it is part of the process, I am of course one of those
>>people who immediately want to find some way to avoid this messy stuff. I
>>don't like it. that's not to say I dont like or want k, but, there has to be
>>a better way. :)
>>
>
>Dan: I think we in the Western world have a love of the light and a fear of
the darkness. We want sanitized white experiences, the good only.
>
>Kali represents another mindset. She is creator and destroyer. They must go
together.  I think of the k more like Kali. For evolution to occur, the less
functional must be destroyed, and replaced by the more functional. 
>
>**********************
>
>With the cranial sacral work that I am doing for my migraines: I have had
one treatment out of an expected 6 to 8. The therapist said, be on the
lookout for releases....(and wouldn't tell me what it meant.)
>
>There was trauma to be sure. In fact, the k was a trauma, and was when I
first noticed these migraines.
>
>After this treatment, on day 2, I slept all night almost in a yogic fish
pose, my chest and lungs were so open. It was an ecstatic experience. I was
awake/asleep/awake/asleep....
>
>On day 3, my diaphragm went crazy with cramps, I had it massaged for an
hour or more. The power coming out was like lightning. At the end, we were
rubbing the whole area down my front, from my sacrum to my forehead and this
energy was pouring out....we were amazed. I was shivering, vibrating,
intensely, lighting up the room with this energy.
>
>Some release, huh? I hope I am beginnig to open some of the doors that have
hidden the darkness of my fear and pain, so that I may move on to face new
levels of life. I am certainly breathing better already.
>
>Best, Patti
>
>
>
>
>



-
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 1996 
From: GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: K and CFS

Jeneifer,
HI, my daughter also has CFS and has been on disability for almost 4 years.
She had a blood transfusion after having a child and got some bad blood, from
the loss of blood she also got Epilepsy. So, you see this is very active
karma. Kundalini is an important part of the awakening process, but as one
comes into these phases of the journey, it is important to be objective and
become self disciplined. Kundalini is not something you do with
emotional/mental imbalance, CFS isn't even something doctors understand. So,
you could have energies working one against the other. My daughter is in
denial in various parts of her life, when she confronts those issues it is
likely the CFS will go. That is my gut feeling. Gloria By the way, the
magnetic mattress pad is helping her. GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com



-
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: knock knock

is anyone on the list 'around' tonight?

Wendy

Leap and the net will appear.
http://www.tiac.net/users/wenders
___________________

       Midnight is when noon is born.       - Chinese proverb
___________________



Date: Sun, 21 Jul 1996 
From: "Michael J. Davis" 
Subject: A "Wenderful" Evening!

Just wanted to let everyone know that I have had a "Wenderful" evening
(morning actually!).

Thanks so much to that special person....there may be hope yet...

Hope you had sweet dreams...hang in there

mjd
***************************
Michael J. Davis
Independent Network Consultant
mjdavisATNOSPAMcompassnet.com

"Skip 18 and 20...go right to 9!"
    Master Rusty McMains



-
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: Re: knock knock

Thank you so much ori, once again.
This was one of the worst days of my life.

Even though I kept telling myself "this is now....time is irrelevant...this
will pass..etc all day.
-
I was completely calm from talking with you.
But then, you already knew I would be, I think 

As for the round, oblong or triangular...if the damn thing would stop moving
around, maybe we'd 'KNOW' eh?  lol

Michael, as you can see by his post, finally found #!Kundalini


Had a good talk.  I hope to help him with something I have some expertise in.  

You both helped me tonight immeasurably.

Bless you,

Wendy


>X-Sender: mermaidATNOSPAMmail.eskimo.com
>To: Wendy 
>From: ori^ 
>
>At 02:15 AM 8/22/96 -0400, you wrote:
>>is anyone on the list 'around' tonight?
>
>round or oblong or is it triangular?
>
>also on irc #!kundalini awaiting you :)
>
>
>**********************
>*       ori^         *
>* mermaidATNOSPAMeskimo.com *
>********************** 
>
>


Leap and the net will appear.
http://www.tiac.net/users/wenders
___________________

       Midnight is when noon is born.       - Chinese proverb
___________________



Date: Thu, 22 Aug 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: Dear Thanks

Dear ori^ and Michael,

Warm thank yous to you both for answering the door tonight, when I knocked.

We are truly never alone.  And, when lonely, have only to knock on the door
here.  Abracadabra.

What a wonderful feeling.
-
Bless you both,

Wendy


Leap and the net will appear.
http://www.tiac.net/users/wenders
___________________

-       Midnight is when noon is born.       - Chinese proverb
___________________



Date: Thu, 22 Aug 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: Maimu

LOL
-
ROFL Maimu....my turn to thank you for the laughs!!!!!  

You do know, btw, that Von SWIPED that line from an earlier post of mine
don't you?

LOL And since Dan doesn't have a dog I told Von he could look like mine.l

i'd be happy with a dog who didn't chew up one of each pair of my shoes and
the men can come later.  I wonder if dogs experience K?
-
Goodnight 

Love,

Wendy
Such a recent divorcee (yesterday!) I can still smell the ink on the house
deed with my name on it.


-
>Date: Wed, 21 Aug 
>X-Sender: mxoATNOSPAMpyrite.som.cwru.edu
Subject: Re: K and CFS

Jennifer,

I have had CFS for 5 years.  Six months ago I had my awakening of kundalini
and have been on quite a ride since then.  I'd like to discuss this
connection with you in some detail.  We can do it here, or, if you prefer to
contact me directly, I'm at HowardCushATNOSPAMaol.com.

In my case I believe there are many connections, but it's very complicated.
 And for me, the most important thing is not to pretend to understand
anything I don't.  Take care,

Howard